1999 3.4L V6 Grand Am, DTC P0440

If the P0440 was popping up before AND after the fuel pump replacement, let's hold off before placing blame on the shop's work. Logically, the fuel pump replacement, likely, had nothing to do with it. First, are you in the habit of filling your fuel tank while the engine is running? That will set a P0440. Second, you've checked the purge valve area, but a common cause of that code is the vent solenoid failure, due to blockage, failed solenoid, or other reasons. If the vent solenoid can't close, then the system won't pressurize and the PCM will set P0440. Conversely, if the purge solenoid is not closing(for similar reasons as the vent sol.) it could also be the problem. However, a visual inspection will not be of much help in this regard. A pressure test will need to be done, or a smoke machine will need to be used. There are so many things it could be(fuel tank press. sensor, any o-ring in the system, or any damaged line), this usually isn't for the diy'er, unless they're mechanically knowlegable.

No, as far as I am aware, the P0440 has only been set over the last three months. The fuel pump was replaced six months ago. I'm not out to blame anyone, just looking for the source of the problem so I can fix it. My personal opinion is that my mechanic is a competent, good guy. I do not fill my tank when the car is running and try not to overfill. My visual inspections were just that: visual. I was looking for the obvious while familiarizing myself with the actual system. I'm definitely a DIYer. Next up is diagnostics and/or parts. My questions about pricing were to help me decide which of several routes to take. I can pick up the ACDelco solenoids and vapor canister for around $100. Discover more engine Dodge Truck I have not seen a sensor related DTC and was hoping that might mean it's not the pressure sensor in the tank. I'm an electrical guy with mechanical leanings . Front end work, minor engine work, cooling and HVAC don't scare me. I'm not in a rush to fix this and do have access to technical documentation.

Okay, I misunderstood. I thought the P0440 was setting before and after the fuel pump replacement, but that was P0442. Now, I understand. If it was me, I'd take it back to the shop, and ask them about it. As a damaged fuel tank line or filler neck or any fuel tank component accidentally damaged could cause it(or like you said, a misinstalled fuel pump). Let them have the chance to fix it(if they're capable).

Where abouts in Ontario Canada are you?

Yea...Like Jeff, I'd like to know too.

Darkrooms, I'd like to take it in but I'm trying to do this on the cheap and it's been six months since the shop did the work. I also have a 2002 V6 Grand Am and my father owns a 2005. Learning to replace the intake manifold gasket on my 99 allowed me to tear through the job on the 2002. I view this job as preparation for the future, lol. When the pump was replaced, the car came in on a truck and I was quoted over $800 for the part. After I got up off the floor, I asked my mechanic if he'd mind me looking around while he checked into aftermarket parts. I found one for $300 after taxes and he installed it. This guy has already helped me out and I don't want to nickel and dime him. When I bring it in, I'm going to say "do it" and leave it at that. Then pay. Jeff & Mohawkmtrs, Would your interest have anything to do with the part prices I mentioned? Windsor, of course!

If you brought me a supplied part to install I probably wouldn't warranty any part of the job but that's just me! Lots of other shops agree with me though. We've all seen lower end parts fail prematurely and our shops left holding the bag expecting to eat the labour for free because the part that they chose not to use from ther suppliers but seems fine by the uninformed customers opinion bites the bullet! Problem being is you often can't prove the parts failure until it's removed again and even then you have to fight to prove it's a parts failure and not an install error. We were talking about this just last week on another site with a fuel pump in a Blazer. The cheaper part that the customer insistted be used lastted 1 week. He had to pay for the labour to replace it twice instead of once plus the diag time to verify that it was in fact faulty. The shop that sold him the pump only refunded his money for the part not the labour. So it cost him more in the long run. Alot more. If I buy a part from my supplier and it fails they pay for my labour to replace it. That's why they cost more, less warranty claims require better built product. Shops do mark up parts. All do or should, every business does! depriving him of that mark up is nickel and diming him and yes he has been fair with you up to this point. 3 months after the fuel pump repair makes me doubt that it was related to that repair and even so with customer supplied parts there's always another variable. It could tthe purge solenoid. They are super common failures on Gms from people overfilling there tanks, so are the cannisters for the same reason. You're leak dtc is likely related or the cause of the 440 dtc! And of course you're trying to do it on the cheap! Almost all do it yourselfers are and the smoke machine isn't cheap so expect to pay for the diag time required to fix this complex system on your car!

jeff compton wrote: If you brought me a supplied part to install I probably wouldn't warranty any part of the job but that's just me! Lots of other shops agree with me though. We've all seen lower end parts fail prematurely and our shops left holding the bag expecting to eat the labour for free because the part that they chose not to use from ther suppliers but seems fine by the uninformed customers opinion bites the bullet! Problem being is you often can't prove the parts failure until it's removed again and even then you have to fight to prove it's a parts failure and not an install error. We were talking about this just last week on another site with a fuel pump in a Blazer. The cheaper part that the customer insistted be used lastted 1 week. He had to pay for the labour to replace it twice instead of once plus the diag time to verify that it was in fact faulty. The shop that sold him the pump only refunded his money for the part not the labour. So it cost him more in the long run. Alot more. If I buy a part from my supplier and it fails they pay for my labour to replace it. That's why they cost more, less warranty claims require better built product. Shops do mark up parts. All do or should, every business does! depriving him of that mark up is nickel and diming him and yes he has been fair with you up to this point. 3 months after the fuel pump repair makes me doubt that it was related to that repair and even so with customer supplied parts there's always another variable. It could tthe purge solenoid. They are super common failures on Gms from people overfilling there tanks, so are the cannisters for the same reason. You're leak dtc is likely related or the cause of the 440 dtc! And of course you're trying to do it on the cheap! Almost all do it yourselfers are and the smoke machine isn't cheap so expect to pay for the diag time required to fix this complex system on your car! Are you sure the bulk of that doesn't belong here? http://www.obd-codes.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2357 I worked in IT for ten years. DIY? You have no idea. Everyone is a computer expert and not shy about letting you know. I bring a number of vehicles to this mechanic and rarely try to debate labour or part prices. His competition down the street brings me shop electronics and PC problems after he's made them worse. Same crap, different bowl. Maybe my DIY cheapskate attitude would be easier to understand if I told you that the car has 388,000 kms on it? This is not a long-term keeper or show car. The aftermarket pump was a Carter (Federal Mogul) with lifetime replacement - the exact same pump a local shop supplier (i.e. my mechanics price, not mine) wanted $440+tax for and gave a 90 day warranty on. My pump: $300 + 2 hrs @ $75 = $450 installed. An ACDelco pump at retail is $800+. I would not expect anyone to warrant a part they did not sell. I also understand the hole I'm in with regards to labour and diagnostics. I mentioned the small leak code and timing of the DTCs because I too feel they're related. I'm not an expert, though, and that's why I'm here throwing out questions.

Yeah that's a brand of jobber pump I've had to send more then 1 back to my supplier because they were NFG right out of the box. Not accusing you of being a tight wad just pointing out how his mark up is yanked by using supplied parts and in turn he may yank his warranty. I understand it's got a lot of mileage so it could be alot of possibilities. I'm still suspect a valve myself but again my Father in Laws 2000 Olds threw that dtc last week because the gas cap was left off. No leak dtc, just the 440 dtc. So a leak could be causing all of your issues! I like OE fuel pumps because they're warranty through my supplier is better. If it's NFG it's no questions asked and I'm reimbursed for my time. That's how we maintain the relationship we've developed. Cheers!

To summarize, my questions: stratagem wrote: I had a local shop replace the fuel pump and now I'm wondering if a leak was created when they did the work. Maybe the tank and pump weren't fitted properly (pump is in the tank)? Is this relatively easy to check? I've never touched the fuel system (for a reason). Where can I find a vacuum pump and gauge for the EVAP system (0-15" H2O, not Hg)? What does an EVAP system smoke test cost? I'm in Ontario, Canada. Will I fail a "Drive Clean" (emissions) test with an EVAP system malfunction? I think the answer is yes but I don't know for sure. I was, of course, also looking for general input on the system failure/large leak. My biggest concern has been how to pressure test the system, or parts of it, without damaging components. Answers received, so far: Darkrooms wrote: Second, you've checked the purge valve area, but a common cause of that code is the vent solenoid failure, due to blockage, failed solenoid, or other reasons. If the vent solenoid can't close, then the system won't pressurize and the PCM will set P0440. Conversely, if the purge solenoid is not closing(for similar reasons as the vent sol.) it could also be the problem. However, a visual inspection will not be of much help in this regard. A pressure test will need to be done, or a smoke machine will need to be used. There are so many things it could be(fuel tank press. sensor, any o-ring in the system, or any damaged line), this usually isn't for the diy'er, unless they're mechanically knowlegable. Thank you. I understand the operation of the system and would like to begin verifcation. If I'm unable to test the entire system, at least I can verify/repair some of it. Any pressure tolerances or details of tools used, besides a smoke machine, would be appreciated. I was going to check vacumm at the PWM purge valve with a 100% duty cycle after checking the dual-use (three connector) PCV hose vacuum. No joy. My Mityvac has a leak and will need repair/replacement before I move forward . jeff compton wrote: 3 months after the fuel pump repair makes me doubt that it was related to that repair and even so with customer supplied parts there's always another variable. It could tthe purge solenoid. They are super common failures on Gms from people overfilling there tanks, so are the cannisters for the same reason. You're leak dtc is likely related or the cause of the 440 dtc! And of course you're trying to do it on the cheap! Almost all do it yourselfers are and the smoke machine isn't cheap so expect to pay for the diag time required to fix this complex system on your car! The pump was installed six months ago, not three. Thank you for the common failure information and opinion of the symptoms. While I agree that the DTCs appear related, I don't see how a system that had a small leak after achieving a specified vacuum can now have charcoal in the purge valve causing complete failure...if in fact the DTCs are related. Charcoal discharge from the canister entering the purge valve would cause constant vacuum or (more likely) none at all. Definitely possible, just not intutive based on the prior slow leak. Thank you for the info though, I'll examine the purge valve vacuum ports for carbon. How much, on average, does a smoke test cost?

Door rates and hour rate for diagnostics being different from region to region I would say 150-250, depends on if it's a visual leak that's easily spotted and there's only 1 or if it's a case of system not flowing or pressurizing and requires component testing! You could start with just a basic check for continuity through the solenoids and try jumping power to them and see if they'll click. If so then with it energized use a vaccum pump and see if it's will hold when it's supposed to. Again evap systems are not really diy'er material without being alot of hit and miss but if I was going to guess I'd try the vent solenoid and the purge valve with new ones before taking it in for diagnosis if that's what you're trying to avoid. At the mileage of your car it could quite likely be one of them or both for that matter.

Diagnosing EVAP problems can be a real headache if you aren't familiar with the system. Enhanced EVAP is even more difficult. I believe yours is the latter. It's really difficult for the home mech. to diag. because the EVAP system stretches the whole length of the vehicle(often) and 1/2 the system is in or on top of the fuel tank, out of sight and reach. Even with a smoke machine it can still be a challenge. Not that you shouldn't try, of course, just letting you know. I believe the EVAP system pressure is 1 psi or less. (Not much at all) Don't pressurize over 1 psi or you risk making it worse.

Belated thanks for the replies. I got sidetracked by a few other issues that came up with the car and the P0440 took a back seat to them. Currently, there's a rope holding the stripped down driver rear door closed - latch died on the weekend. Fun car , I'll have that fixed up in a day or two. As for the EVAP problem, I replaced the purge solenoid. The was no charcoal discharge evident in the purge hose or solenoid. While I was removing the two hoses, I found a 1-1.5 cm crack along the bottom of the PCV (vac source) hose end. The hose seems to have a tight fit to the new purge solenoid but I'll be replacing the PCV hose in a week or two anyway. After replacement and code clearing, P0440 was set as soon as the diagnostic ran. It was cleared and a P0442 was set shortly after. I've cleared it and now await the next role of the dice. Oh, my Mityvac is dead. It was one of the "engineered resin" models with no replaceable parts. Anyone know a good source for the metal version in the Windsor/Detroit area? $14.00 so far. Next up is the canister vent solenoid. After that it will probably be the shop. I'll try to post an update.