Marketwatch: Tesla investors approve Elon Musk’s $1 trillion pay package — but the money won’t come easy

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And what’s the failstate; what are the criteria by which his sanity is assessed?

That's down to the shareholders, not random redditors thankfully.

Not an answer to the question I asked. Also, some are both.

"not so much that I can’t be fired if I go insane." - Didn't he already cross that bridge?

It partially answers the question, because you'll get VERY different answers from both parties.

The failstate is he doesn't get awarded stock.

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> it’s not like I’m going to go spend the money. Hmm… I seem to remember that he used to have substantially more shares of TSLA, but then he sold off a huge chunk, paid the world’s largest tax bill, and then bought Twitter, causing TSLA’s share price to crash. So forgive me for being skeptical that he’s not going to sell these shares and spend the money. I did vote for Musk to get the pay package. I skimmed through the terms… I think there’s sufficient rules in there preventing him from selling for several years.

Not exactly democratic as it’s weighted by shares held by shareholders

I'm glad thats where you think others are drawing the line LMAO Really should be eye opening for you

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This isn’t how real people speak

Apparently some semblance of an answer is too difficult for you

The opposite.

actually the money will come very easily - he can literally just buy the products himself and make 3x as much

So buying products from yourself makes you 3x richer? Why doesn’t everyone do this??

Better than someone with 1 share having the same influence as me or Vanguard. This is a company, not a government. Edit: To expand, the USA is a government for the people, by the people. Each person gets an equal vote. Public Companies are governed shares of ownership. Each share gets an equal vote. (ignoring stocks with different classes)

Elon is one of the few sane public figures

What are you even talking about

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🚀 les go!!

If he is able to juice the market cap up to almost 10 trillion dollars then the shareholders will all be very happy and rich. Even more reason to vote him the pay package.

Because every company doesn’t have stupid P/E? And every founder doesn’t have huge pay packages for hitting valuation goals? I mean it’s an obvious money glitch if Musk could juice sales without killing P/E. There’s a 249x multiple right now, so buying his own cars actually makes sense with his pay package. Problem with that is there’s no way he could buy a ton of cars without someone noticing and the whole scheme crashing.

Yeah and when the ceo is the majority shareholder and thus has outsized influence on these votes, that really brings into question wether average Joe shareholder’s vote matters at all. It doesn’t. And the company will never change.

I’d love to have that built in home battery usage he promised.

Do I really need to explain? lol if you even have to genuinely think you have to defend 'if you're republican, you're an insane person' (which wasn't what the OP commenter was saying) you've lost the plot and aren't even trying to find it on purpose.

What change is needed at Tesla? Or what is going on at Tesla now that indicates they need change?

Interesting that you went there. Is that what you feel deep down? Elon's crazy actions that most point out have nothing to do with him being a Republican (if he even is).

You obviously haven't seen him dance on stage.

A ceo who isn’t the second most polarizing public figure.

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A lot of the requirements are things like sell a million robots. Sell 20 million cars. He can literally just buy them himself. He’s already shown that he can manipulate the market for the stock price. His companies make no profit. The reason he got this package is because the company’s profit isn’t based on fundamentals- it’s based on a Ponzi scheme that he threatened to crash. Whether the stock price is a trillion or not 7 trillion if it’s not based on fundamentals it’s not a stable business. But investors are willing to play the game and bet they can get out if needed. Privatize gains publicize losses.

Wait, can he just buy them himself? I know arithmetic. 20 million cars times 50000 dollars per car is 1 trillion dollars. Elon doesn't have this kind of money (yet).

To get his trillion dollar payout, he has to: \- Grow annual EBITDA from $16B to $400B \- Deliver 1 million Optimus robots \- Have 1 million Robotaxis in operation \- Have a succession plan in place \- 6x the market cap of the company (which is already pricing in a huge amount of growth at a P/E ratio of 260), providing several trillion dollars of value to other shareholders. |Tranche|Market Cap Milestone|Operational Milestone| |:-|:-|:-| |1|$2.0T|$50B Adjusted EBITDA| |2|$2.5T|$80B Adjusted EBITDA| |3|$3.0T|$130B Adjusted EBITDA| |4|$3.5T|$210B Adjusted EBITDA| |5|$4.0T|$300B Adjusted EBITDA| |6|$4.5T|$400B Adjusted EBITDA (in three non-overlapping periods)| |7|$5.0T|$400B Adjusted EBITDA (in three non-overlapping periods)| |8|$5.5T|$400B Adjusted EBITDA (in three non-overlapping periods)| |9|$6.0T|20M Tesla Vehicles Delivered (cumulative)| |10|$6.5T|10M Active FSD Subscriptions| |11|$7.5T|1M Bots Delivered + CEO Succession Plan| |12|$8.5T|1M Robotaxis in Commercial Operation + CEO Succession Plan|

Elon is not the majority shareholder. I believe he currently holds less than 10% of outstanding shares.

wrong [https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyk6kvyxvzo](https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cwyk6kvyxvzo)

He receives 35B today, how much for each Tranche?

How are Full Self Driving, Roadster 2, and the Vegas tunnel not on the list?

13% from what I can see in the article? Not far off from what that guy said…

sure but he is the single biggest shareholder.

|Tranche|Market Cap Milestone|Operational Milestone|Value at Target ($B)|Cumulative Value at Target ($B)| |:-|:-|:-|:-|:-| |1|$2.0T|$50B Adjusted EBITDA|20.29|20.29| |2|$2.5T|$80B Adjusted EBITDA|25.11|50.22| |3|$3.0T|$130B Adjusted EBITDA|29.83|89.50| |4|$3.5T|$210B Adjusted EBITDA|34.46|137.85| |5|$4.0T|$300B Adjusted EBITDA|39.00|195.01| |6|$4.5T|$400B Adjusted EBITDA (in three non-overlapping periods)|43.45|260.73| |7|$5.0T|$400B Adjusted EBITDA (in three non-overlapping periods)|47.82|334.75| |8|$5.5T|$400B Adjusted EBITDA (in three non-overlapping periods)|52.10|416.84| |9|$6.0T|20M Tesla Vehicles Delivered (cumulative)|56.31|506.77| |10|$6.5T|10M Active FSD Subscriptions|60.43|604.33| |11|$7.5T|1M Bots Delivered + CEO Succession Plan|69.09|759.97| |12|$8.5T|1M Robotaxis in Commercial Operation + CEO Succession Plan|77.59|931.03|

Having a majority shareholder means having over 50% - ie. they hold the majority of the shares. Elon has 13% and even if he's the largest shareholder he cannot simply vote himself whatever he wants.

> His companies make no profit How do you figure that? Tesla had an EBITDA of $12.44bn last year. SpaceX is likely either profitable or on the edge of being profitable given the growth of Starlink. They could turn it into a highly profitable business overnight if they weren't investing so heavily in future advances, so it would seem a bit churlish to try and label it as unsuccessful.

Sounds like you're making that connection yourself, he didn't say anything about Republicans

Though like Tranche 1 is already a completely extreme salary for a CEO.

So cute you think this is true

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Dance like no one is watching mate you'll have a better time.

Lmao.

Insane. He should've been kicked out of the company long time ago.

Yes at great pain to him. He really didn't want to sell tsla, but twitter was banning and censoring even babylon bee,  so elon had to step up.

Musk the person or Musk the CEO of Tesla?

Maybe because FSD is literally on the list (how else you plan to a CV ieve 1mio of robotaxis?), roadster 2 is fun project with no meaningful impact on the company and tunnel is Boring company project?

If majority agrees he can, he does not have majority of shares or will at the end.

A great opportunity to let him go…

To be clear, I think the operational milestones can be completed in any order.

For people not using old.reddit, your comment is rated controversial, so it's a lot closer to a 50-50 split of votes, despite the seemingly negative ~~-24~~ -48 score your comment is currently at.

What other company does what Tesla does? So of course he's gonna get paid what other CEOs don't get paid. Otherwise he could leave and start some other company doing something else that will pay him.

Yeah, but that's not what "literally" means.

Do you hear yourself?

"even babylon bee" lmao

Tesla is not a serious company anymore. This pay package when sales are down and Elon was directly responsible for ending the EV tax credit. He’s the only ceo that’s not fiduciary to their company.

Then it doesn't matter? If he fails he gets nothing. He would have to grow it to the most absurdly large company in history for any of this to work and the odds of that are very low.  Seems like a fairly low risk gamble for everyone involved.

If you think he caused TSLA share price to crash, why did you vote in favor of giving him a trillion dollars?

How can I contribute to making sure this never happens?

Why take the gamble at all by not getting rid of musk and hiring a non-insane ceo that is fiduciary to Tesla?

Really ignorant unnecessary comment imho. Or rather triggering instead of ignorant.

It shouldn't be either. People with more skin in the game should have more deciding power.

>6x the market cap of the company (which is already pricing in a huge amount of growth at a P/E ratio of 260), providing several trillion dollars of value to other shareholders. Presumably taking Tesla from 1.5 to 8.5 bn will reduce the p/e ratio from it's already bonkers high of 250 unless the price of shares also goes up 6 times. Which will make it 6 times bigger by market cap than the next 10 carmakers combined. Or 77 times bigger than Uber. https://wolfstreet.com/2021/10/26/teslas-market-cap-gigantic-v-next-10-automakers-v-teslas-global-market-share-minuscule/

What do you mean? These are the terms of the contract which has just been approved.

This comment triggered me

Any other robotics company for the robots, any other motor company for the EVs, Enron for CEO culture?

The royal value of Tesla revenue to date is about $500bn. To reward a CEO with essentially $1 for every $10 of product sold ever is insane. Is there any other package to a CEO that's even telly comparable?

Right back at ya.

5 years ago I'd agree... but at this point I think he's been somewhat exposed as a nut who rides on other people's ideas. If you want an idea what you'd get with a Musk company from the ground up - look at the cybertruck

That's a completely different statement than your first one.

Sorry about that 54yearoldHOTMOM

I voted "no" with my tiny amount of shares. EDIT: There are a lot of comments against the pay package. Why are people downvoting me for voting against the pay package?

Yeah this is starting to make no sense. Back in the days robotaxi was a huge potential win for Tesla because of the very low cost to operate, versus an Uber. But at these valuations even at Uber’s revenue (not profits, PURE revenue), it still doesn’t make any sense. Tesla bot has potential, but that’s a cultural shift that’s gonna be hard to sell. It’s part of the reason why AR/XR failed. Tesla bot has potential, but because of the cultural aspect, growth will be a slow burn. I was bullish on Elon’s first pay plan back in the day because the path was feasible. Making hundreds of thousands of car has been proven to be possible by other car companies. The risk was just whether or not Tesla can meet the manufacturing capability. This… this is far more different. Somehow not only they need to take ALL of Uber’s revenue (not just profits), then increase the demand for robotaxi by several fold, and then culturally convince the population having a humanoid robot in your home is perfectly normal. Hell, even the increase demand for robotaxi part likely will come down to “you don’t need to own a car anymore”, which is also another cultural shift.

How do you feel about democracy? Should people who pay more taxes be the ones who decide?

Elon was directly responsible for EV tax credit? Making shit up now?

You do realize that the insane market cap of Tesla is simply because of him, right? TSLA is really just worth about $40 per share if we're being serious here. And we already have a Tesla without Elon, it's called RIVN.

Elon was not insane before but he is insane now. He changed. Why is this hard?

He helped Trump win who is anti-EV.

Tesla does make a profit but barely. So far in 2025 their profit has been about 2.5 billion and shrinking. Q3 2025 Net Income: Tesla reported a GAAP net income of $1.4 billion, a 37% drop from the same period in 2024. Q2 2025 Net Income: GAAP net income was $1.172 billion. Q1 2025 Net Income: Net income plummeted 71% year-over-year to $409 million Their cybertruck is pretty much dead, the robots don’t exist - no he’s not being legions of them, and the solar part is doing ok I believe - keeping the company profitable. 3 billion in profit for a 1.3 trillion dollar company now. And they made 13 billion in 2024? Pretty decent but going down hill isn’t a good sign. I guess there is a chance they deliver FSD but they have been saying that for literally a decade now. How is that robotaxi business doing - oh ya it’s not the profit monster that was promised - like all his talk. For comparison Microsoft a company worth 3x as much made 75 billion approx in the same period. Or about 25 billion is equivalent market cap. This makes Tesla 10x over valued than Microsoft. Space x is planning an IPO at approx 500 billion. It’s not profitable. Starlink also by definition cannot scale well - hence the continued increasing in price. The problem with low orbit satellites is that they zip by extremely fast unlike deep space satellites that can target a fixed point in sync with earth. What this means is that in any given point a single satellite is spending about 2/3rds its time over the ocean or middle of no where unusable and you need to continuously launch them. The only reason it’s profitable today is that he has found a large payout from militaries to drive drones - who are willing to subsidize the rest of the project. And there is limited bandwidth on the ones that do zip by so you can’t say sign up a major city. It’s perfect for rural access but the total users are limited and the price can’t scale. It might be profitable but not 500 billion profitable. Space x is propped up by government spending basically - and the government is stingy - unless of course you become part of it and drive contracts to yourself. You think he’s making money blowing up dozens of rockets - 2 years ago he said if the rockets he is launching ( and are blowing up ) wasn’t successful in a year the company would go bankrupt - it still hasn’t finished it. Boring company is basically non existent - they built some things that were nothing like the promise. Neural link is a money pit. I don’t think he’s turned X around into profitable. Looks like it isn’t. XAI apparently loses a billion a year. I’m sure I’m missing some other businesses here. Only 1 of which is profitable. Dude has 1 business - that has its market dominance disappear - which means less profit margins. There is now competition in the ev market with great cars from competitors and he’s actually behind the robotaxi market. He is still the only affordable self driving personal vehicle. So yes, he has a couple of viable businesses that could - if managed well turn a profit but when your market cap is 10x other companies and the lifetime profit of the companies your running is maybe 25x less than your personal networth something is wrong.

Try finding an even more tenuous link. Maybe dinosaurs are responsible for this.

How is this tenuous? Trump said he’d end the EV mandate and hates renewables and Musk helped him.

He's one of a kind. He is crazy, but if Elon is swapped out, Tesla stock will absolutely tank. You can be correct (and you are), but his unique approach has led him to being the richest man on the planet for a reason.

Trying to understand your point... You're suggesting that SpaceX and Tesla's success and progress would have happened just as well without Musk leading them, because all he does is "ride on other people's ideas." Have I got that right?

Yes, you have that right. Apple is still Apple. Microsoft and Google are still Microsoft and Google.

Correlation is not causation

Yes, that's correct.

There's not a lot of success in terms of money making, more on promises and stories. Financially, Tesla doesn't hold a candle to the companies with which it shares its market cap. Logical answer? Bubble.

He can complete the operational milestones in any order. The first 3 tranches are relatively easy to achieve over 10 years.

Yeah only have to 5x the EBITDA and double the market cap of a company traded at a P/E of 260. Ez pz.

I love how many people are posting "easy to achieve over 10 years" as though a slow growing Tesla won't crater to a PE of ~20.

An EBITA of $400B equates to a PE of about 30i to 40sh. Maybe, just maybe, if Tesla builds self-driving, robots, and the batteries to electrify the grid then they aren't a car company at that point?

TSLA is largely a meme stock. It's influenced by reality, but mostly it's expensive because it's expensive. Without Elon, there's a chance it's valued as a car/energy/robot company alone, and immediately tanks in value. Edit: And when I say tank, I don't mean go down a lot like the previous crash. If they go down to be worth twice as much as Toyota, who sells 5x as many cars, TSLA is worth 1/3rd of what it was. As a car/energy/robot company, I think it would do fine without Elon. As a stock owner, you'd be voting on if you want to just light most of your stock on fire.

Is the American “democratic” voting for President not weighted? The Constitution spells out exactly how one person is NOT one vote that counts for that office (only Electorial College votes count). People throw around the term democratic so carelessly. What democratic means in corporate law is generally only one common share is one vote.

yeah that's precisely why the electoral college is such a point of contention. the government in the us is much more than the president

Alphabet made about $33 billion in profit in Q3. That's roughly the same as Tesla has made in its entire existence. That's not a knock on Musk by the way. But he's not the only guy capable of building good companies. And he could hit several of those milestones without doing anything specular. Basically just maintaining status quo.

> If you want an idea what you'd get with a Musk company from the ground up - look at the cybertruck This isn't the dunk you think it is.

We should let you go

Jump

Ui

First they came for the Babylon Bee...

Well, that's a set of targets. As a long term Tesla buyer and former investor. Nope. I won't ever again go near Tesla or any Musk products.

That slight negative spread will get fixed with redistricting /s

I don’t really understand this comment. Did you mean to reply to someone else?

Is this sarcasm? I really can’t even tell if you’re serious

Nope. Read the cop out rules, which is more than suspicious that nobody is mentioning. You all actually just approved rules that can be changed at any time for any reason.

As a stock owner, you lit your money on fire when you bought a company on its hype value instead of its fundamentals. That's like witnessing for yourself that diesel locomotives are going to put steamers out of business, so betting heavy on Baldwin and Lima since they're out front right now. When of course what really happens is some upstart shows up and runs the table while the old companies go WTF. The key to robo isn't the car hardware. Many cars have the hardware and many cars have much better hardware.

Why would I be sarky? They were far left before. Now they're much more balanced. The world needs a neutral public square,  not just lefty platforms.

If you’re not trolling, please put the internet down and go touch grass.

Could you be more specific and point to the clause you’re referring to? I didn’t vote for the pay package. If you have a point to make, then make it.

Regardless of how someone got there, the reason to keep Elon in charge is the same. Keeping the stock in meme status instead of anywhere closed to their level of performance. Maybe someone bought early and the stock kept going up. Maybe they did buy into a company based on hype. Hopefully they didn't buy it because they thought the global 200b taxi market will somehow be worth 1,000b. But the fact remains, everyone with a vote *is* a shareholder, and it's in their best interest (second to, in my opinion, cashing out) not to light their shares on fire *immediately*.

Before I type out a full reply, can I check that you're willing to debate this in good faith? Reddit is somewhat polluted by haters who just mindlessly downvote and then childishly block you after posting a reply full of inaccuracies, as if that somehow wins the discussion. I'm more than happy to debate but would rather not waste my time unless you're in a similar place.

What other CEO could build and run Tesla?

> Tesla bot has potential, but that’s a cultural shift that’s gonna be hard to sell. Maybe, maybe not. Consumers have proven they don't give two shits about privacy, so I don't see any barriers beyond price into getting them into people's homes. Unlike AR, it's not like you're wearing it on your face, nor do you need it to ever leave the house with you/be seen with it. And if they develop one that actually does what it says on the tin, such that it can handle all chores, take the kids to school, cook meals, walk the dog, what have you, I can see it taking off.

I actually can't. It has the same issue as AR/VR. Amazing technology, but it creates a socially awkward situation for a lot of people. Having a robot in your home is something one has to get used to, and that's gonna be a cultural friction. If the Tesla bot was less humanoid looking, it (ironically) might actually have a higher chance.

What does an insane public figure look like to you, then?

There are basically no "lefty" mainstream news outlets. Everything is owned by right wing billionaires.

Small scale: don't buy a Tesla product. Large scale: create a competing company with a better product, thus ensuring no one else wants to buy a Tesla product.

He stated he [did not want the tax credit to exist](https://www.politico.com/live-updates/2024/12/05/congress/elon-musk-electric-cars-00192848), then [paid for the election](https://edition.cnn.com/2025/02/01/politics/elon-musk-2024-election-spending-millions) of a man who [promised to make the tax credit stop existing](https://www.taxnotes.com/featured-news/ill-scrap-ira-tax-credits-day-1-trump-says/2023/09/28/7hdjq). How much stronger of a link do you want?

Most people don't own companies with ridiculous valuations and pay packages attached? Are you dense?

I'm sure he can price them at under $50k for himself. Not to mention he wouldn't need to buy all 20 million, just any shortfall.

54 years young and he will NEVER spend ONE MILLION 💲of that money. Let’s hope he donates large sums of that money to find a cure for his own Asperger's syndrome and cancer cures!!

"Literally" here means buying all 20 million. Lower prices would affect average selling price, which itself would tank Tesla's stock. He probably wouldn't have the money to buy them even at 20k each in this scenario, because most of his net worth is in Tesla stock which would decrease in price in this scenario.

Eh. There are more than enough opportunities for the bot, even if 90+% of the general public are luddites.

> they aren't a car company at that point? Elon has been saying exactly that on the last 5 earnings calls.

> causing TSLA’s share price to crash. It's currently trading very close to the all time high.

Bet a) he can't keep his mouth shut about things that don't concern him b) he'll fudge it somehow. But one hope he's in Mars by the time that payday happens

As long as the stock number goes up he can probably get away with damn near anything. If it crashes I would expect that definition to become much stricter

90% is optimistic lol. Maybe 99.99% for a product like this. The Tesla Bot has a way higher chance of success in a manufacturing plant or shipping center.

What about SpaceX?

Nothing more than a PR stunt.

This Roland guy: https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1986833400171577503

Robots already exist in factories, and they're far better than this.

Is that 20 million cumulative vehicles delivered including what's already been delivered? Or 20 million starting now? Kind of seems like all of this could be accomplished through subsidized contracts with other companies (basically pay people to buy your cars and subscribe to FSD) and the shareholders and market define the companies value which essentially allows him to reach the goal without anyone other than him and the shareholders getting value out of it

a commercial failure? An utter monstrosity of a product with such poor quality control I don't know where to begin. They put out a product with warnings in the owners manual on how not to point a hose at the windows while washing it (yes, it's real.. go look) and almost all of them you see are wrapped because untreated stainless steel.. actually stains.

You didn't answer the question. You changed the subject to comparing the company to other large cap companies where I guess you believe those CEOs didn't "ride the ideas of others." 🤷‍♂️ We are all dumber after having read your arguments. I hope for mercy on your soul.

NASA was more important to SpaceX success than Musk

SpaceX has saved NASA billions of dollars.

Your missing the point entirely.

Where is the model 2 or the 1000s of robo taxis? Maybe if we had sub 25k EVs from Tesla, I'll be cheering for Elon......honestly? I would. That is mass market price value of a car. I would get one. So far, he puffs himself up with ideas that take years to accomplish. If anytime the model 2 is announced and is the mass market price, I wouldn't care that he gets his trillion bucks. As of now, he don't deserve it but then again which CEO deserves more millions? None do.

Musk is gonna try to use Colossus 2 to mine crypto

Also it's achievable with a reduction in vehicle deliveries and with far below average stock growth.

Well, one of us certainly is NASA has thrown 2x the money they pay SpaceX at Boeing/ULS. How's that going?

How would the stock grow with falling sales and none of the other milestones hit? The p/e is already above 260.

lol

It has done exactly that for the last two years.

$5B revenue growth doesn't reflect a lack of growth to me.

In the above comments, these things were mentioned: vehicle deliveries stock growth p/e All of which are going in a bad direction. Can you tell me which of these is revenue? Can you, further, tell me what period of time you are quoting this revenue from? Do you genuinely not know about the falling sales? And what is this insane line of reasoning that you people are using these days, trying to say that this is a great plan because TSLA is already overvalued so how could the milestones possibly get hit, so thats why we need to vote for it because we'll never get the money that we're all counting on getting? You're arguing yourself into circles. I don't understand how you can just make an entire existence out of trolling yourself.