Tesla vs GM: How they cool EV motors differently | Munro & Associates

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Good video but they bring up a benefit of GM’s approach (energy consumption) without bringing up a significant drawback, which is that the oil flow can’t be precisely modulated/controlled like it can with Tesla’s approach. Oil flow is coupled to motor speed.

Also, I don't buy the energy savings. Flinging up oil using the main drive motor isn't free. And with that approach, there's zero control on how much oil is flung up, most likely causing it to fling way more oil than actually needed. All in all, there's a good chance that uses more energy than the Tesla solution that has fine control over the amount of oil pumped.

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Sure, but GM can simply push bigger batteries where required. Tesla can't or won't.

I mean he talks about that in detail starting at 14:00, but ok.

Yeah but depending on  bigger batteries shows that they're less dependent/committed onto efficiency.  That does matter to some of us who drives quite a bit and electricity isn't as cheap as it was over here as compared to a few years ago.

its not that easy as the GM system is built to be cheap but also have more temperature issues as a result and thus more failliures and warranty claims that also cost money.

I think it highlights Tesla's lack of progress on battery and motor technology. Tesla doesn't have a technological lead in the basic underpinnings of EVs like they used to. You can buy more range and more performance elsewhere and Tesla hasn't made a drivetrain update to their flagships in nearly five years. I am concerned that GM has a more modular strategy. Lucid has superior base tech (and bottomless cash.) I realize that FSD is the new, great thing, but I fear that Tesla has taken its eye off the ball when it comes to advancing the EV basics that they used to crush with. I fear they're in a race to the bottom trying to sell cheaper cars rather than trying to dominate with better cars.

I’d encourage you to check out Out Of Spec’s Seattle to Boston EV race if you’re worried about battery/motor performance. Model 3 highland got 2nd place out of 10 cars, only behind the Porsche Taycan, while being one of the cheapest options because they focus on efficiency rather than jamming in extra (expensive) batteries.

>without bringing up a significant drawback, which is that the oil flow can’t be precisely modulated/controlled like it can with Tesla’s approach From the OP, which I assume is the provided video summary: >Tesla’s high-pressure oil delivery system offers **precise, targeted cooling** to critical motor components [...] and >Meanwhile, GM’s gravity-fed oil **distribution system takes a more passive approach** [...] I was confused when I read your comment because I had just read the summary and it directly talks about it. Maybe you mean you wanted more emphasis on that point?

While that's true, Team Lucid absolutely screwed themselves, strategically and the Model S should have done better, but didn't. Porsche taking first place, especially over the Model S, should be a big deal to Tesla. When was the last time the Model S got a battery upgrade? They've been running the same 100kwh pack with only minor cooling changes for almost a decade. I admit that I'm peeved that Tesla, which used to be a premium near-luxury brand has become an automotive appliance company. I started driving Model S' in 2015 back when they were considered unique, interesting and cool. I would prefer Tesla model themselves more after Audi, Porsche, MB or BMW than Hyundai and Kia. I keep hoping the 48v electrical, steer-by-wire and four-wheel steering from the Cybertruck come to the S and X, but... I guess I'll just keep waiting.

I would bet that Tesla's approach results in a much cheaper motor. Certainly cheaper per HP. GM's approach is the same in a way as it was with ICE vehicles, more cubic inches is swapped for more batteries. Forcing the gas motors to better MPG has resulted in disasters there. See the 6.2L V8 mess.

Lucid's cooling method (timestamped video): https://youtu.be/7vLhMulKZRw?t=1944

Oil gets flung off gears regardless when they spin, catching and directing it doesn’t change efficiency. Oil flow correlates directly with couple motor/gear use and the size of the oil channels which are tuned to the motor. The main drawback is its gravity fed which can cause issues in steep angle and high G performance situations. Otherwise it seems genius, turning an active complex system into a passive less complex system while retaining performance for normal driving

And that plan is just one of many reasons that GM is writing down a huge loss on their EV business.

If Tesla was really committed to efficiencies we would have smaller wheels on all the models

It's wild what a difference it makes, but...looks.

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but if we skipped that part and didn't read the summary, it wasn't covered very well at all!

Tesla is also the only one manufacturing EVs at a large scale, at affordable prices, and making a profit. Everyone else, to my knowledge, can't do all 3.

If Tesla was really committed to efficiencies, we wouldn't have any vehicles that look like they do now. Performance, efficiency, and aesthetics are all at war with each other, and a successful car company has to walk a fine line between them.

It does. What are you calling spirited driving that you do with your Tesla?

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Are you though? The number of people who actually take performance vehicles (any vehicle, not just Tesla) to the track is abysmally low. So many people have no idea how much their cars are capable of, and how little they themselves are capable of.

Slightly smaller wheels than what Tesla uses would factually increase performance and efficiency, with aesthetics being an opinion

Agreed, though the choice of tire generally matters more than wheel size. The primary efficency difference say between an 18" Aero wheel and 19" on Model 3 comes down to the rubber..

tesla (musk really) is fully comitted to FSD. According to Musk's vision private ownership of cars are on the cusp of becoming redundant. So why focus on engineering something thats about to become obsolete? If they ever get robotaxi to a point where it's better than a human in every case, why would you want to own a car and drive it yourself?

Honda insight. (The old one) Looked like shit

Who’s design is cheaper to make?

Because I can store my own stuff in the car and it's always ready at a moments notice? Or because I don't want to concern myself with a lack of transportation when there's a rush, major event, natural disaster or network outage.

wonderful points. why don't you format them in a tweet and send it to musk and hopefully he reads it and changes his entire 20 year outlook on the company.

Lucid has a more compact motor/inverter system but it’s much more costly to manufacture so it’s not clear that in real world terms it’s superior. You have to consider the ability to scale and hit price targets too when it comes to engineering a car. I honestly don’t even think that they’ll be in business in another five years unless Saudi Arabia is just crazy about pouring money into them.

Not an option we know what looks like crap if you are a car guy.

I thought EVs do not have oil or coolant. Either this video or EVs are a lie