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X doubt
Musk and release dates lol
sigh
What I don’t understand is how come he claims this car will be fully autonomous yet FSD has to state Supervised now. It just sounds like another one of his porky pies.
June. Which year?
Never believe this dude on any deadlines ever. This dude does the exact opposite of “under promise and over deliver”. I’d absolutely hate to be an employee at Tesla with the absurd timelines he tells the public.
These will definitely not get vandalised.
Customer-owned 2-seater? It'll be as popular as Cybertruck, maybe slightly less, if it has no steering wheel.
🤡🤡🤡🤡
Good, still not touching anything Musk has his hands on anymore.
Why do I need a robo taxi if my tesla drive’s itself? Oh no wait they never released that either
There's no way in hell that current HW4 or HW3 are capable of self-driving. The robotaxi will have set routes and probably have additional hardware that's not on any of the current fleet.
They're adding remote supervisors. No controls in the car equals full autonomy.
I disagree. It would be perfect for my commute when we already have our model y for family duty
Afaik they solve any issues with remote takeovers like other robotic taxi companies. They've also talked a bit about hw5, not sure if that's in CT or not.
So my comment is correct; no current fleet can self-drive.
Don't we already have customer owned cars? Shouldn't the goal here be replacing the need for customer owned cars?
Well, it's more of a regulatory issue than a technical one at this point.. you need to be allowed to fully self drive to iron out every issue. After some experience, development and data from fully autonomous taxis supported by remote emergency drivers, they can certify the rest of the fleet.
You are missing the point. The current hardware isn't capable of self-driving. Forget the regulatory issue.
Q1 numbers are looking that bad, huh? Gotta say something to keep the stock price up.
The human ”supervisors” will likely be underpaid, 3rd world kids sitting in car simulators. Not “self driving“ at all.
Long before I wanted to add my own car to a Tesla robotaxi network and drive other people around, I’d want my car to act as my personal robotaxi. Like drive me and my family places without having to watch the road. Where is that step?
Uhm, why not? It's certainly racking up billions of self-driving miles?
No chance for either. But especially the customer owned ones
Because every intervention is a crash or a death without a human there.
You can easily make it more careful when you know there's not a human there.. you could technically even run the first trips with live remote operators.
With a driver behind the wheel and instructions to be on standby for it doing dumb stuff...
It doesn't exist but Musk is saying it will for sure this time .... 🙄
😂 haha
The article's dated on April Fool's Day. So this totally tracks...
Yeah, but it'll certainly be running under different rules, and in controlled environments (no highways, geo-fenced etc) for a considerable time until the technology is proven.
What? This is exactly what waymo did in the start..
Those are going to be one in the same thing, if we can believe the descriptions he has given so far. A couple years back he had said something about you could have a "friends circle" who could be the authorized to use your "unsupervised FSD" car ... and not put your car into a rotation pool of the entire general public. So, you could just make a friend circle of yourself and a couple family members. That actually could have pretty wild implications if you think about a family of 5 adults (mom, dad, 3 kids) might often be expected to own 5 cars. What if we could just get by with 3 of them now? I suspect "Unsupervised FSD" will have a monthly subscription though - because you do need remote operators to sometimes intervene when the car isn't sure what to do (Waymo and Cruise have the same).
After gutting any agency with safety oversight, I would stay FAR away from these, including on the road
Then by that definition I’d be getting the same full autonomy experience ordering an Uber and sitting in the back and ignoring the driver
Last stock holder meeting it was all robotaxi Robotaxi robotaxi and they mentioned that as an afterthought when an institutional investor asked about it and said towards the end of 2026
There will be a software release this summer of "unsupervised FSD" which is what will power the Robotaxi, and eventually "unsupervised FSD" will make it down to customer-owned vehicles. I fully expect this will *not* be free to existing FSD customers (and thus, the potential for lawsuits) because they almost certainly will need to fund a remote operator crew for a while (just as Waymo and Cruise do) and that has a recurring cost.
No, the driver will only step in if needed, not actually driving the car.. over time one monitor might handle thousands of cars, and only if something really unexpected happens. Of course they'll be careful from the start.
This guy been saying this my whole adult life
I don't think you've ever used FSD; if so, you wouldn't be even asking this question
I am quite impressed with HW3 on the latest FSD drop, to the point where I'm ready to convert from subscription based to paid (fortunately it's only $2k since I was an EAP customer from 2018). I can go days and days and days without ever needing to intervene (outside of nav preferences where I want it to take a different way). Would I feel comfortable hopping in the back seat? I don't know. Maybe? But that's the first time I can honestly even say that. Would I feel comfortable in the back seat if there were remote operators in case the car got stuck / got itself into a bad spot? A bit more so. Definitely curious to see what the summertime drops look like.
But how can you say that any issues are hardware related? If the processing power is too low, as it is on hw3, I'd get it.. they have not stated that hw4 has any difficulties or incompatibilities?
It always reminds me of this scene from Silcon Valley https://youtu.be/sFwWCPz5hj4?si=pENil8lIJ2mUpsLH
At least this time the stock is ignoring him
*Tell me you don't drive a FSD-enabled car, without telling me you don't drive a FSD-enabled car...*
No, I think he means CyberCab (2 seater) robotaxi starts this summer, Model S/3/X/Y owners will be allowed to put their personal vehicles into the fleet in 2026. I don't expect they're ever going to sell cybercab to consumers. I mean, just the inductive charging design alone presents challenges when you're out and about.
Not trusting this until they fix zipper merges on FSD
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Where do you think the Waymo and Cruise remote operators sit?
Impressed doesn't = safe. Every day, my HW3 car does something stupid. Sure, it might not be life-threatening every time, but it only takes one time. It still can't even park by itself without hitting pillars.
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Gives me a good excuse to take the spouse on a trip to Austin this year! (Austin is obviously just a cool city in general, but hey - this could be fun in term of informing my investment portfolio a bit further)
Hey, I'd love to be proved wrong.
Is he still planning to take a cross country ride - including charging - in 2019?
If it is, they're going broke.. so I guess we'll see.
I dream of a tomorrow where our cars can self park at superchargers. It is enjoyable to watch someone try to back in but the tech is there to give us a party trick that’ll save some drivers the embarrassment.
Soon after they get started, the revenue from Robotaxi (cybercab and S3XY) will far outweigh the cost of remote intervention for privately used cybercabs. For privately used S3XY there is no need for remote intervention, they have controls. Only publically used Robotaxis might have those controls disabled and need remote intervention.
That's great. Now fix the windshield wiper sensor.
Guys for sure this time he’s not fibbing!!! Pinky promise this time!!
Sure 👍
“Concerning” I mean “Your lack of faith is concerning” 😂
Fun. I mean he has been so right about when FSD is going to be here, so I would trust this item. 🙄
It was by the end of 2017, that he predicted a Tesla would be able to drive itself cross country.
it’s a shell game. They’ll probably do an event with a few people riding a few blocks on a specific route, then they’ll announce actually availability will be in 3-6 months. They’ll repeat this twice until they shift to hyping the robots. This has been exactly what they’ve done with fsd for a decade.
yes.
Do you even have FSD? I intervene on most drives, but I can't remember the last time it was to avoid a crash. It's basically always because I prefer it to be in a different lane, or it's doing something dumb like switching into a turn-only lane that I know it's going to have to get out of in a few seconds.
What are you basing that off of? i have a HW3 and HW4 car. I could probably see the HW3 being capable, at worst it's just a little indecisive in virtually all of my miles driven for the past several months. HW4 is very smooth. I haven't had to intervene to avoid a dangerous situation in months.
Ah yes, the same robotaxi that was supposed to be out in 2020. Or that FSD was supposed to be released EOY in 2016. Or that CT was going to have 500+ miles of range. Or that SpaceX will land on Mars by 2020. Or that humans will be on Mars by 2024.
I've used it, recently, but not for long because I think it's really not close or trustworthy. I'm not saying it'll never get there but maybe with this set of cameras only it will never get there, or at least I'll never trust it. And it's not close to not needing a human. Interventions where a human steps in for any reason versus no human to step in for any reason, if you can imagine, it goes from it's stalling for no reason to it's shouldn't be in this lane, to it curbed the tires on that curve to it hit that car to I died. It's not close. The only way they're running unsupervised in the summer is literally going to be with humans inside them supervising. It's nice to be optimistic to push your team to achieve what is thought to be impossible but a 10 year track record of being wrong here and the tech literally not being close to unsupervised means it will not be. If you take out your desire to want it to be a certain way because of the stock or something else, and look at it objectively, next time you're using FSD, never intervene at all to see how it would handle it without out. If you do that (never intervene at all) how long until it crashes do you think? Do you think you have the guts to see what happens? Obviously you shouldn't because it's super unsafe as it is now for you to not supervise it. I don't want to keep saying this over and over to other people. Some realize it's not close others want to pretend projected deadlines have meaning after 10 years of them being missed, despite a tech that is clear within minutes of using that it's not even close to not needing a human present.
Remote supervisors? You mean like a guy in Brazil? "Jesus, take the wheel."
Can't fix something that isn't there.
> Interventions where a human steps in for any reason versus no human to step in for any reason, if you can imagine, it goes from it's stalling for no reason to it's shouldn't be in this lane, to it curbed the tires on that curve to it hit that car to I died. Second time you've repeated that statement (every intervention is evidence that FSD isn't safe/ready). Totally incorrect. 100% of my interventions since 12.6.4 released have been preference-related, nothing to do with safety. Extrapolating my anecdote out, it's not hard to imagine that a large amount of interventions are for similar reasons. Seems rather unlikely, if not impossible, that my experience would be completely opposite everyone else's experience.
The worst.
You only look at things he missed, and overlook the release dates he was not way off. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcJcQA0-qDU](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcJcQA0-qDU) Starlink was announced in 2015, he estimated it can have a first version in 5 years, the reality was it started operational in 2021, it is damn close.
China has self-driving buses that has been free to the public for several years now.
So misrepresent the publicly traded company but hold true to the private one. Gotcha.
I imagine it's even worse now that he doesn't even really work at Tesla anymore and sirens all his time elsewhere.
Haha 😆 but yes.. only after the car has stopped and need help getting around obstacles and such though.
If there’s anyone you can trust with a release date, it’s musk. I can’t think of any other time he’s gotten one wrong…then again I don’t remember much since the concussion
What do you mean "confirm"? He just pumping the stock like he has done for the last 10 years or so. Full self driving is perpetually less than a year away.
On track for June, pushed back until October to finalize the tech, pushed back to Feb to add things that will make it even better, pushed back to June because they found a way to make even safer. This isn’t my first rodeo.
OTA update.?.?
Is there a bookie where I can place bets against this 2026 promise? Never going to happen.
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If this taxi uses cameras and only cameras it will be a disaster.
Just give us the option for slower speeds, my 1992 civic had this…just 1 wipe per minute.
If there’s anything I learned as a Tesla driver it’s don’t trust their release dates.
..and in 2019 he promised level 5 autonomy and robo taxis by 2020. That was *checks watch* 5 years ago.
Tesla doesn't use rain sensors like nearly every other brand. They rely solely on the cameras and software to interpret when it is wet. While in theory it could work, in practice it doesn't seem to work well, with dry wiping being a common complaint.
later he complained that they could do it, but they would have to fake it so they decided against it
we will know the answer by July
>Why would you assume that? Personal use has been the plan all along if you want. The robotaxi launch in June* will not be available for consumers to purchase, they will be on the road with full-time drivers who are just "supervising". *The robotaxis will be equipped with the same FSD we already have in Teslas, (probably a more up-to-date branch), and the drivers will just take over when something goes wrong. He's doing this because it is smoke and mirrors. They aren't enabling literally anymore data collection than the millions of cars on the road, they're just going to exist to get investors excited about the brand again. So nothing new is launching. It's the same shit he has been pedaling for a decade now.
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I have a Model y with FSD, I love it. It is nowhere near ready for a robo taxi style autonomy.
But they aren't enabling that in June. The entire point is that he has been promising the functionality that you are talking about for years, (just about a decade). And the first iteration we get are Teslas none of us own and are just fancy Ubers? The better question is after a decade of moving the goalposts and keeping his customers in the dark, why would you assume that we will ever see this functionality with our cars? 2026 is supposedly the rollout for personal vehicles, but so was 2020. The robotaxis in the wild already have cameras not seen on production models - that's clearly showing that what's in production is not FSD ready, (or at least the engineering team doesn't believe it is). I'm genuinely confused what makes you believe that this will come to fruition other than Musk saying it? And if that has convinced you, why?
Spot on. it’s just not happening lol.
Ah yes the first 20 years - just untill they make FSD work, with hardware that can never make it work... on a software stack that cannot handle it.
You have to admit that the progress done the last two years has been really good..
It has, and I admire the software engineers at Tesla - but there is a huge leap from impressive tech to safe 100% of the time tech... which is what self driving systems needs to be (or very very very close to) And I simply think that with current sensors - hardware and software they are never able to solve it.. Will they some day, sure, when we have high res live satellites to feed the car with live data - or whatever tech will allow this goal to be achieved.
I am am basing it of my personal FSD daily experience.
I don't thing the current hardware stack and sensor suite will ever be able to do unsupervised FSD.
Obviously, and I think Tesla knows that, but they don't want to say it and crash the stock even further.
Sorry, are you saying a guy monitoring thousands of cars is going to jump in to stop a kid getting run over? How?
That's not going to happen in June. FSD isn't good enough that you can let it drive around unsupervised and just have someone take over if it gets stuck in a car park. We're still seeing videos of the latest FSD where cars just steer into oncoming traffic, a remote supervisor isn't enough for that.
The car already can do this. The monitoree is there to back the car up from the curb once it went off road to avoid the kid.
I agree, if they can't fix stuff like this, they'll have to postpone.. they can however do extensive mapping/training for a small area for trials once they're sure enough. I still expect incidents at first, just like waymo has had.
It’s the Roadster! Finally!
"Musk confirms" is about as credible as the old meme "Illuminati confirmed".
FSD is complete. Just software left.
June of which year?
Elon time vs revolutionary market disruption epochs
Why would you want to do this, when ~~Tesla~~ *you* can't even profit from it?
Anyone else remember a ~2017 story about a Silicon Valley nerd that was going to buy 3 Model 3s and sit on them until FSD was done in six months or so and then either resell them for 150k each or put them into use as robo taxis?
Usually he delays much earlier than this. Could still be but the fact they keep doubling down on June launch for robotaxis tells me it'll very likely as least be this year if not actually in june
June of what year?
Unsupervised Teslas “driving” people around, I can’t wait to see the videos of people trashing them as they drive by
yes
Didn’t want to spend the $10 for a rain sensor. Now we have to deal with windshield coming on when it’s sunny outside and not coming on when it’s raining. All for $10 on a $50k car.
Tesla (well Musk anyway) and release dates are classic.
Are you new here? I'm asking because I heard the Waymo comparison for years and I keep telling people why Waymo's approach is not scalable whereas Tesla's is. Not sure if you know what I'm talking about.
Yeah... coming in hot... behind Waymo in many markets.
I’ll go on the record with the promise to rip off my own ballsack and eat it if this deadline is realized. Elon Musk, a guy with an impregnation fetish, and his lies about timelines are beyond old.
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Private family taxi would be sweet. No need to have one car per family member. Drop each person off at work/school and then come back.
If they’re confident enough to have fully unmanned taxis, why does unsupervised FSD feel so out of reach?
I’m constantly having the opposite problem. Barely any wipes regardless of wet or dry. It could be a full downpour and it’ll maybe wipe once every few minutes
Sure bud
A lot of tesla employees are saying the same though.
And hardware retrofit for v3. And regulatory approval. And whose insurance is responsible when it screws up. But yeah, it’s basically complete! Just all the moving parts left.
How would a customer owned car robotaxi work? For example, can I drive it to the airport and then it can drive itself home and park in the garage?
If it wasn't clear, I was mocking one of the dumbest, most laughable things Elon has ever said.
Who in their right mind is going to lend their car out to Robo taxi? This whole idea is bonkers
lol not happening. Just an attempt to raise the stock price.
Waymo seems to have it all figured out already, 200k+ paid rides a week and growing. I think Tesla will get there, but they are years behind and Waymo is focused on rapid scaling.
Lol that will never ever happen.
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Im using the latest fsd. Love it but dont see how it becomes a robotaxi. Long way to go
They definitely are not profitable as a whole but there are signs that their operations reached positive unit economics last year. JMP Research: https://x.com/aleximm/status/1828938865517965809?s=46
That's hilarious. So cute if you believe him.
cobweb attempt fall pause hospital coherent saw jar violet rainstorm *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev/home)*
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Imagine Tesla stock value if people were smarter and could see through the BS that musk is spewing.
Meanwhile in an unmentionable other country, flying robo-copters.
Currently his cars have qualified drivers in them yet still cannot operate FSD, what is the difference here?
They can, at least in the US and China?
“Confirms” Fool me once, shame on Elon. Fool me a thousand times, shame on me.
🤣 April Fools!
Man, I just got a Juniper a week ago and it hasn’t stopped raining since. I’ve had zero issues with the wipers. Reddit had me so nervous about it but it’s been a non-issue.
Model 3 came roughly on time didn't it? He usually delivers in the end, and that's the most important thing.
For many drivers, FSD is pretty much perfect.
I am one of those drivers haha, but despite it 99% of the time feeling perfect, I still can't look away from the road for longer than a few seconds, or look down to respond to a text without the car freaking out at me, and as far as I'm aware they haven't alluded to that changing anytime soon I do understand the safety aspect since it can be slightly goofy every now and then, but that's why I'm slightly confused by their confidence in the robotaxi. Idk what these taxis would have that the main line vehicles don't that makes their FSD fine to be unsupervised
If it misses the deadline my guess is he will fire the entire team, his way of making things more efficient.
Lies.
Having my Tesla drive me down to Austin in June to get one of the first rides. Can't wait. FSD currently drives about 98% of my drives now. It is so nice to be able to just sit back and relax and allow my car to drive me. It feels like magic.
“Robotaxi your car in 2026” is the new “summon your car cross country before the end of the year” 😂
Yep
Fsd tried to go around a school bus today on me. Unless this thing is running fsd version 16+ or something I’m definitely concerned
Notice they never talk about liability. Who will be liable for a customer-owned robotaxi? No sane person would take on that liability and any insurance company sure as hell won’t either.
Don't confuse robo taxi service and cyber cab. These are two separate things
“We could do it but not really so we didn’t do it. Totally not our fault”. Funny how this used to be just funny, looking back it just shows what Musk really is.
the autopilot gets worse every year for four years straight. And now anyone who paints a picture on the back of their trailer can bait the tesla autopilot to hit him and get a nice payday in the court.
Musk's june is a spiritual concept that is above the concept of "a year"
> I do understand the safety aspect since it can be slightly goofy every now and then Do you mean it does something that is unsafe, or it does something that is safe, but is bad driving etiquette?
You forgot pushed back for the SpaceX Launch Edition. It's gonna fly baby fly. Ah sorry, I forgot the update. It's going to be the Boring Company Edition ... wait for it... it's gonna drill baby drill!
Ah... is it gonna be on the Tesla Network? And the reason we can't robotaxi a Model 3 is...?
That show more true than most people realize.
I have no idea who would downvote this. This is precisely how it is going to work. I swear this sub has been overrun by the angry kiddies who are mad they can't destroy Teslas anymore.
You mean the top selling EV Pickup? Did you mean for that to be an insult?
Yeah, either that or a lot of early fsd customers that have given up and sold their cars.. 😅
Like driving each person and do the same?
okay i'm 100% pro-Doge but this made me chuckle
\*shrug\* Back when we picked up our first Tesla, we considered getting the FSD. But it was clear to us (and was perfectly clear to everyone on every forum including Reddit) that the timeline was aspirational and making any decision based on it would be risky. So while I understand the frustration to some degree, I also do not have an overflowing amount of sympathy for anyone who took the risk and it didn't pan out. Now, I have long held that Tesla should change their policy with FSD to make it transferable to a new car until it is really ready and then give people something like a 6 month grace period to change it over one last time. I think that would get a \*lot\* more people to buy into it.
Definitely.. and to be honest, if they halved the price, I bet more than twice as many would buy it.. If they had a perfect working system, that could perhaps be worth the price, but we're still some time away from that it seems.
I'm still totally stoked by the full production of the Semi that was to fit sure begin in... 2017? 2019? 2021? Oh wait, they delivered 18? Thankfully, I guess, people eventually forgot about it. I mean, except for Pepsi et al
lol remember the Roadster 2.0?
Baaaaaaarely.
I call BS on this.
Dude is gonna end up losing epic legendary amount of money.
For specific definitions of 2017, yes! /s
So why is Waymo’s approach not scalable whereas Tesla’s is? Other guys comment got deleted but I also don’t know what you’re talking about
It’s because Robo Taxi will be fully GeoMapped in the same way that Waymo is. They’ll only work on certain roads, even though that goes against the entire Tesla FSD ethos.
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