Next-Gen Tesla Supercharger

When will we actually see a site with this capability? All the current locations with V4 dispensers still have the V3 power equipment supplying them.

Doesnt matter when s3xy cars all capped @ 250 max

Tesla said in a post on X that it would be the beginning of next year.

Would really make sense if more cars could charge at those rates. Not holding my breath but crossing my fingers.

Wake me up when it can do 1.21 Gigawatts.

I have a feeling the new Y will be able to charge faster. It's be pointless to build these chargers when vast majority can't use them. Big selling feature too.

For equipment expected to stick around for much longer that the current car models, it absolutely matters. So many non-tesla chargers around me are still stuck at 50kW because they thought like you when installing them years ago

When will Teslas (except CT) have >800V architecture to profit from that?

We’ll likely see the S/X get refreshed in next 2-3 years with 800V architecture after they finish robotaxi & roadster development + rollout. Then a full Model 3 & Y refresh with 800V after that, since they just did Highland and are soon releasing Juniper.

The site by Knotts Berry has them

Jiggawatts you mean

It matters because it can supply 8 of those stalls at once, rather than the current 4.

If it's going to wait for Robotaxi + Roadster rollout then we're gonna be waiting a LOT longer than 2-3 years.

Unlikely. refresh Y is likely to use the same batteries as before, hence same charge rate.

Will the cable be positioned and of sufficient length to allow non-teslas with other charge port positions charge without taking up other spaces?

There are plenty other cars that can and will take advantage of the faster charging speed. New competition for Ionity and others.

Yes there already are V4 chargers out there with longer cables.

yeah this is dumb, companies can and should be able to walk and chew gum at the same time.

Juniper might have it on release if they’re rushing this out now

Are these for newer vehicles only? I went to one with my model 3 (2023) and only got 250kw at max.

Not anymore. https://x.com/teslacharging/status/1857133221538148638

Not going to happen. Too big of a change for a midlife refresh. Juniper will be mostly cosmetic, NVH, and ride comfort like the Highland.

The Cybertruck will do close to 500, but agreed, it’s not sexy.

Except it isn't lack of foresight. It's just the innovation cycle. There's no profit in guessing what will be appreciated in 10 years when there isn't enough market to support the early hardware generations. Always deploy a minimum viable product first then iterate. We all get left behind eventually.

At my local Superchargers no matter if you need 100, 150 or 200+ miles charge the speed is Socialized out to 50 minutes. Why I don't believe the marketing about "Charging in 12 minutes" and such

Nope, those are stalls, not cabinets

I wouldn't be surprised if only the Cybertruck with Range Extender can do 500 kW. When NxuOne charged the Cybertruck on 800V it topped out at 327 kW.

All V4 posts today are connected to V3.5 cabinets which only provides 250 kW; sites with V4 cabinets will start in 2025. These are still for all Teslas, but 800V vehicles with large packs like the Cybertruck or other pickups/SUVs will take best advantage of the higher power output.

Of course it matters, chicken vs egg… they need to upgrade superchargers for future cars. Infrastructure will take a lot longer to upgrade than the fleet of cars..

I thought the supercharger team got dismantled in the last round of layoffs?

This is the winning comment I was looking for.

My wife told by Tesla people working on a supercharger that Oyster Point SC was set up for 350kw charging. I wasn’t there so I couldn’t dig into whether it was actually a V3 cabinet.

[deleted]

Where do you mean? Oyster Point, South Carolina? Is there something being built there? I don't see anything listed at [supercharge.info](https://supercharge.info/map?Center=32.70728,-79.91283&Zoom=12&RangeKm=282).

Hard disagree. They need to move forward if their mission is to “accelerate the world to sustainable energy” This is made even more apparent when you factor in their market cap vs revenue

Sorry, Oyster Point near San Francisco, I assume this one: [https://www.tesla.com/findus?v=2&bounds=37.69440349186831%2C-122.35634804995728%2C37.63281173171866%2C-122.43801595004273&zoom=15&filters=store%2Cservice%2Csupercharger%2Cdestination%20charger%2Cbodyshop%2Cparty%2Cself%20serve%20demo%20drive%2Cnacs%2Cdelivery%20centers&search=Oyster%20Point%2C%20South%20San%20Francisco%2C%20CA%2C%20USA&location=35515](https://www.tesla.com/findus?v=2&bounds=37.69440349186831%2C-122.35634804995728%2C37.63281173171866%2C-122.43801595004273&zoom=15&filters=store%2Cservice%2Csupercharger%2Cdestination%20charger%2Cbodyshop%2Cparty%2Cself%20serve%20demo%20drive%2Cnacs%2Cdelivery%20centers&search=Oyster%20Point%2C%20South%20San%20Francisco%2C%20CA%2C%20USA&location=35515) Again, we've never been there, and I posed the same questions to my wife that y'all have suspicions about (v3.5 with 250kw cabinets?). All I know is that technicians working on the Tanforan or San Bruno SCs at the time said Oyster Point was 350kw. Shrug. Our legacy MX doesn't even hit 250, so there's little reason or way for us to test it.

Futureproofing

If they announced these in a couple of years (after they started selling >250 kW capable vehicles in volume) people would be saying "Would really make sense if they started installing these a couple of years ago so there are enough of them about to be useful".

Which supercharger is this?

There aren't any live ones yet, so you didn't go to one of these.

Note: This video is identical to the one posted 4 days ago on X. Your questions are likely answered in that thread. https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1grc4fm/tesla_on_x_v4_cabinet/

https://preview.redd.it/2evvsrkmis1e1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2c932889d66c55f056d2df948b7a75ea9a9b96ca So this was just my imagination i guess???

That's a V4 post, attached to a V3 cabinet. This video is about the V4 cabinet.

Ok

They already have the best selling, second best selling and third best selling EV in US last quarter. Also opening access to Superchargers for all EV. I would say Tesla had done plenty to accelerate. Upgrade all their vehicles to 800V doesn’t make sense when the first v4 500kW charger won’t even be installed next year. It will take 2-3 years after the first v4 to have sufficient # to matter.

Ahh, yeah, that would probably be referring to the V3 cabinet. They are capable of drawing either 350 kW or 387 kW from the grid and each serves 3 or 4 posts at a maximum of 250 kW per post. Sounds like there could be contention if you're splitting 350 kW four ways, but the V3 cabinets can also share capacity between themselves, so if there are two cabinets next to each and one is entirely empty, the other cabinet can then effectively share 700 kW between its four stalls. But no matter how they are configured, no individual post will get more than 250 kW. Not a limitation of the post, but the output from the cabinet. [This is the nameplate from a V3 cabinet](https://i.imgur.com/ZBCDXXW.png). Sounds complicated! Don't worry, V4 does away with the connection between cabinets. Each cabinet has a single grid connection (presumed to be 1.2MW, but we haven't seen evidence yet) and eight posts (each capable of 500 kW). Obviously you won't get eight cars drawing 500 kW at a time, but Tesla have so much data on this that they've worked out that this ratio does not result in any noticeable contention, since cars are only at their peak speed for a very short part of their charge cycle, and for many cars, this peak will only be 250 kW, or 170 kW.

Great but isnt the max speed of Teslas 250kw/h. I know It will take a long time for these stations to be readily available in (insert my local charging station address) but when will we start seeing 500kw/h Teslas?

I don’t think it’s that big of a change at all. All the 800v hardware has been developed for the cybertruck already. They might even be doing 48v. If they refresh their most popular model right now and stick with 400v then it will be 4+ years before they do 800v and everyone else will have caught up.

Looks like they weren’t needed after all.

And it seems they don't want to keep that position for a little better profit. I bought a M3P about 6 years ago and won't buy something new from Tesla if they don't come up with a better MS or MX that have their flaws fixed. A updated M3 or MY late is nice but too little of a difference.

Bringing the 3 and Y to 800V makes no real sense. A 70kWh battery with our current technology only hits the limit of a 400V charger for a couple of minutes. So you may save 20 seconds per charge on 800V. Even a Cybertruck with its bigger battery only charges 30% faster over a full charge. On the other hand, the battery pack gets more complicated because you want to be able to charge at a 400V charger, too. Dual-voltage charging isn't trivial. So unless we get a new battery technology that can take a higher charge rate, or all chargers are 800V, configuring packs with less than ~100kWh capacity for 800V has more cons than pros.

Maximum charge rate scales linearly with battery size unless limited by other components. So, based on your numbers, a Cybertruck with a Range Extender would top out at 460 kW.

Not sure what you want to say with your post, but you're correct on one point: **The charge duration per cell is always the same for the same cell chemistry at its maximum rate.** So, if you had an ideal connection from the charger to all cells, all charging would take the same time. It wouldn't matter at all how many cells are in a pack. It's just like boiling eggs; if one egg takes 5 minutes, boiling 10,000 eggs at the same time also takes 5 minutes. The only reason we get different charging times is that the cells are not always the limit. There's also the cable, the plug, the charger, the pack cooling, the power electronics, engineers' decisions on how close to the theoretical maximum to go to not damage the cells, and so on.

They've done 400kW+ on third party chargers with later firmware, and it's still improving.

The charging curves on the Porsche Taycan and Hyundai Ioniq 5 seem to disagree with your assessment. They hold their peaks for quite a long time.

what the hells a jigawatt?

Do we know what the limiting factor on holding that peak is though?

"rushing this out now" Who says this is rushing anything?

It's developed but that doesn't mean it's ready to scale up to their most popular model.

As shown literally in this post, it allows for them to have only one unit for 8 stalls and also can support larger vehicles if they're there. It's not pointless.

Firmware isn't set up to expect those speeds yet probably.

The team was dismantled organizationally but they rebuilt it under Tesla energy I believe.

"the speed is Socialized out to 50 minutes" What are you even trying to say? If it's crowded you'll get lower speeds. And how much charge you need doesn't dictate your speed.

Why did they call the lorry a semi? Is it some sort of innuendo?

Sure, it wouldn't be unsurprising if Tesla has more tweaks to the charge curve but 500 kW / 123 kWh ≅ 4.1C ... quite the step up! (Versus 327 kW / 123 kWh ≅ 2.7C, or with a 47 kWh? range extender 500 kW / 170 kW ≅ 2.9C) Edit: Not sure how I missed the [report in September ](https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-cybertruck-over-400-kw-600-kw-charger-europe/)of a cybertruck hitting 405 kW on a 600kW charger... still that's ≅ 3.3C and drops off near immediately.

What I'm trying to say is that whatever charge I need, whether the lot is full, 50% or 25% full, it always takes 50 minutes to complete the charge. Never 15, never 30, never 1.5 hours. Always 50 minutes.

Awesome, not sure how I missed that report. \[an [article referencing source](https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-cybertruck-over-400-kw-600-kw-charger-europe/)\]. 405 kW / 123 kWh ≅ 3.3C

Lakewood Drive Windsor CA

Sorry. Almost pointless.

We don't know. Which is why you said unlikely and likely.

Going on the more recent reports of 404 kW (which I missed), charging a (123+47=) 170 kWh cybertruck x 3.3C ≅ 561 kW

About time. I just wish they would upgrade old V2 sites to V4s, alongside new installations.

It's the amount of power you need for a flux capacitor.

The CT can charge at these speeds it's got 800v architecture. But there are no (Tesla) cabinets to support it, I'm guessing they'll roll them out as CT ramps and upon refreshes they'll upgrade the cars.

that's heavy

Out of spec motoring channel just did a road trip race across the ENTIRE COUNTRY over 3,000 miles. spoiler alert, the model 3 beat The Ioniq 6 (though it was very close). And worth noting the Tesla had a bunch of V2 superchargers on the route too (and those had only 150kw). Taycan beat all the EVs (and was the only thing to beat the model 3) but you mentioning the Tycan means that you're not understanding the above commenter's assessment. The Taycan has a LARGER battery pack than the model 3 or model Y, so the current limitations come into play there...due to the pack being larger. Notice how the Ioniq6 and Ioniq 5 can't charge above 250kw, and the Tesla model 3 actually has a higher peak charging speed than those cars.

Nope. That's the max speed their current fastest superchargers can put out. There are already Teslas that can charge faster (Cybertruck) but you'll never see it charge faster on CURRENT Tesla chargers because of the charger's limitation...but that doesn't mean the truck itself has a 250kw charging limit.

Well, starting sometime in 2025.

It matters because it will allow faster charging for non-Tesla 800V cars as well, meaning faster turnover at chargers and less wait time even if your car doesn’t support 800V.

Existing Model S, X, 3, and Y are still limited to 250kW as far as we know. This is mostly a big deal for Cybertruck and non-Tesla EVs that have 800V charging, which there are quite a few of now. Since existing Tesla chargers only support 400V, charging for cars like the Kia and Hyundai EVs is slow (100kW). These will allow native 200-300kW charging for those cars and reduce how long they spend at Superchargers.

That’s what Tesla has always called it since they are an American company. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semi-trailer_truck

What SoC are you charging up to? 100%?

I stand corrected.

The ioniq6 did get pulled over by the police and still came within a few mins of the Tesla. Not knocking the Tesla - it is the best car of the bunch for the price.... but context matters. that being said, that taycan is nice. it holds 300 KW up to 60%

This fundamentally does not make sense. Whatever charge you need - meaning if you need 10% it takes 50 mins? No. That being said. 0-80 is faster than 80-100.

I haven't tried charging 90-100. Today I was running errands, didn't need to charge but did need a loaf of bread from the baker across the street from the chargers. So why not park there. https://preview.redd.it/whu9o10l3y1e1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=89fe470bff71b98ac736c0a098517485c342c02e

Nope those are V4

Quick google says the Taycan has a pack of 90 to 105 kWh. That's right in the range I gave for when an 800V system starts to have advantages. Aside from that, "holding the peak" is a bit suspicious. It's not a behaviour that's supported by the cell chemistry. According to that, every change in charge level changes the available charge current. So that flat area must be caused by something else, like a limit in the power electronics or the software. So they are either capping the real peak, or they're driving the batteries above what they deem safe for the rest of the charge curve to extend the peak. (As it's chemistry, there's no hard limit, it's all probabilities and heat accumulation.)

I don't think they gave the exact duration of the traffic stop...it could've been more or less than the 13 minutes apart they came....but the fact that they were that close after 3,000+ miles tells me the Ioniq6 doesn't have any significant charging advantage in real world conditions...otherwise it'd have outweighed a traffic stop after 3,000+ miles.

I mean - EA woes and all that. Another thing to consider is the i6 has a smaller battery and worse efficiency, so it probably had at least one more full charge than the Tesla. FWIW I owned an Ioniq5 before my model Y (it died and got lemoned) - the eGMP charging curve when you have a charger that can support it is significantly better than my 2023 MYLR. In ideal conditions, its about 6 minutes faster from n-80 than the Tesla is. The catch there is of course "in ideal conditions", I can count the number of times on 1 hand i had working full rate 350kw EA stations - but when i did it was glorious. Tesla on the other hand is "slower" but significantly more reliable.

I don't think the charge curve has much to do with 800v or 400v though...it's more on the specific pack. Higher voltage just removes current limitations. For example, the 2024 long range model 3's can actually come with 2 different battery packs (Lg and Panasonic I believe) and the Panasonic one has vastly better charging performance (Despite them being the same voltage) But yeah, in the end, real world is what matters. The one thing I wish they'd include in these road trip tests is charging cost. Without any free charging promotions in place, I'd imagine the Tesla costs FAR less to charge. Using less power is a small part of it, but the superchargers I've seen have been between 31cents to 42 cents/kwh...Electrify America seems to be from 48 cents to 64 cents (just from what I've seen and seen in their clips) so even if you get the subscription and save 25% from the electrify America price, it'd still be a lot higher than superchargers. (I know cost is besides the point and doesn't effect speed, I just wish their tests included it)

I could be wrong - but I think the 800v does massively help the charging curve. Yes the pack matters because of C rating and all that, but heat is a major limiting factor, and half the current means significantly less heat. Less load on the cable, less load on the battery, etc

Frankly, 250 kw is plenty fast. My car is more than adequately charged before I finish using a bathroom or eat a small snack on a road trip. And the car charges at 250kw for only a couple minutes before it starts dropping so there is no logical reason to double the capacity that is certainly not going to be used except maybe by the semi and even then I'd bet it would be very brief. I'd rather have them use the funds to build more 250kw chargers. Especially in the rural parts of Northern US.

The lesson of that race is that you don't need a huge battery pack or 800v charging if you have a comprehensive and reliable charging network

There hasn't been a single **full** V4 site built yet. Existing sites with V4 stalls still use V3 cabinets.

It also means less overall congestion, as CT and future models grow and start taking up more SC stalls. Not to mention all of the non-Tesla models that will take advantage of it in the not-too-distant future.

Yes still choppy

> after they finish robotaxi & roadster development + rollout lol. So in 10 years

> If competition doesn’t have 800v architecture, they don’t have competition But they do?

But this is not their mission. Their mission is to make money and/or have a high stock price.

https://preview.redd.it/017b63lh3x2e1.jpeg?width=2604&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a620665379aa91fc1edccd3454f3b2be38c2dec5 and here's charging from 64 miles right now

lol could be, but I'm hoping for something closer to 3-5 years. Elon usually shows up late, but he ultimately still delivers!

Yeah there are no V4 cabinets yet in the US, the V4 dispensers are REALLY nice though. A much needed upgrade.