The Ponzi scheme continues....
Fuck yeah. Go all in baby! $30B has been burning a hole in their pockets for years and years. Why prop up your crumbling auto business when you can turbo charge the cash incinerator with XAi? He’s completely fucked and it’s delicious.
It’s hard to believe the stock will ever blow up and actually price at fundamentals given how long this has all gone on but he’s going to keep pushing until it does. Tesla, in essence, will have bailed out the twitter purchase. Amazing.
TSLA shareholders should vote rather or not criminal charges should be filed against Musk and xAI for stealing AI talent, AI Chips, and whether Musk has committed fraud by originally promising TSLA as being an AI Company and then attempting to squander more money from TSLA to prop up his personal AI Company.
Tesla now up over a percent in oth asia trading hours on this news
XAi has been losing a billion dollars a month and projected to lose 12-15 billion dollars for 2025.
It will happen slowly and then all at once.
How can anyone still have any doubt Tesla is Musk's personal piggy bank? Failing solar company owned by your brother? No problem, Tesla will buy it. Failing social media platform? Money torch AI startup? Again, Tesla to the rescue. He's received an inordinate amount of value from those EV subsidies.
The shareholders meeting has been push back to November now. Lol.
[I didn't expect it this soon.](https://www.reddit.com/r/RealTesla/comments/1lyz4p5/comment/n2y0ivu/?context=3)
Did he end up doing the thing that made xAI the parent company of Twitter? So basically Tesla is now buying Twitter?
This is probably going to be a scrip deal where Tesla issues new Tesla shares to the owners of xAI shares instead of giving them cash. Essentially this is Elon giving himself more Tesla shares to hold onto control of the company.
If you’re still a Tesla shareholder at this point then that’s on you
I’m guessing this will be Tesla issuing new shares, not paying cash. Essentially Elon is diluting shareholders to give himself more control of the company.
“Will have”? It already happened. He stole investor money to give to himself and pay for Twitter, then used xAI investor money to keep Tesla stock propped up.
Can’t see it. XAI needs cash. Badly. Fundraising round went from $20B in equity to $3B from outside investors, $2B from SpaceX and $5B in debt at 12.5%. The only play is a cash transfer from Tesla. With basically $0 in revenue and at least $12B in expenses to keep the lights on what the fuck else are they going to do?
If this goes through, whatever money tesla makes or lose, the hole in their bank will get bigger with xAI and tesla. xAI is losing a billion every month. Google, Microsoft, and META can afford AI investments because how massive their profits are. SpaceX is buying equity in xAI mainly to prop up cap, so when tesla buys xAI, theyre paying a higher premium. Elon is against tesla shareholders lol.
Why he said xAI has enough capital or dan to shut up? Writing was on the wall lol
That was the “slowly” part. This will be the “all at once” part.
So basically the "bonus" scheme again, but in a new exciting way
If xAI needs cash, Tesla paying cash to the owners of xAI doesn’t help the situation, it makes it worse. If Tesla acquires xAI then xAI will then get access to Teslas cash.
All from government, but Medicaid is the issue
Love this energy :). Fuck the nazzy.
"If the courts won't approve us handing 60bn to Elon from our floundering company's coffers, we'll just buy his copy paste "product" for 60bn instead!
Go public and become the new meme stock to make million on
The cult loves the idea of throwing Tesla's hard-earned cash in the xAI incinerator.
so all the cash to put in capex for new models and battery factories will instead be going to Nvidia servers to make fascist friendly chatbots which have no business model???? it will ruin Tesla’s future. Let people who want xAI and want the risk pay for it.
AND paying back the people that helped him buy Twitter
It almost feels like a binary thing at this point; the stock is either in megabubble territory or $0 after the business finally implodes and musk gets margin called
Correct me if I’m wrong but doesn’t a shareholders vote mean squat because Fusk holds either a majority share or controlling share of votes that count?
Shares won’t help xAI, that would be a stupid move to put $4 Billion of shares on the market for sale to fund this deal. It would have to be cash on hand to make this even remotely attractive.
Generally when you buy a company, the deal is with the owners of the company, not the company itself. You issue the new shares to the owners of the company you are acquiring, in this case that is mostly Elon, and Elons buddy’s/allies. Giving them more Tesla shares is exactly what Elon wants, and it saves the cash on hand to be pumped into xAI after the acquisition closes.
Failing auto business. Who's going to buy it?
Elon is not asking for TSLA to take ownership of xAI, is it? XAI is valued at around $200 B after xAI acquired X (Twitter) not sure how the market values xAI at $200B but that is what it is valued at. $4B would just be a stake and I doubt xAI or Elon wants shares, Elon needs cash to keep xAI afloat.
SpaceX I guess?
What is your source for $200B? Last I saw loan holders of the Twitter buyout had written down the book value of Twitter to less than $10B
I asked ChatGpt current valuation is $113B without the current funding round, with the current funding $200B
Sigh. We are so doomed. Ok, so Elon tried to do a funding round that would put xAI at $200B valuation and the funding round had been a flop so far. So then he went and directed $2B from SpaceXs latest round to be put into xAI at a valuation of $113B - so all these numbers are just Elon pumping the books. Back in March, Elon had xAI acquire X (Twitter) for $33B in a deal that valued xAI post acquisition at $80B, which is again, more Elon numbers as it was a scrip deal, but if we apply the banks valuation to the deal, it makes xAIs actual valuation closer to $20B. Teslas institutional holders would actually blow a gasket if Elon directed Tesla to invest into xAI at any of the numbers he’s been floating, so he will likely just turn around and propose a scrip buyout that’s well above the banks valuation, but well below what he’s been trying to get, and call it a win, netting himself a good chunk of extra Tesla control.
Huh. It's been Tesplained so many times that TeSla Is an AI cOMpaNIe!!!...it's weird TSLA would pay $billions into another AI company. I wish I understood 5d chess.
ABG - Always be grifting.
You seem to be presuming they would be buying existing shares v new shares, but I don’t see that specified in the article. Existing shares, I agree with you. New ones, I don’t.
You need to disclose financials. Kryptonite to Elon.
This whole deal will end up with Tesla completing a full acquisition of xAI. It’s so transparent that this whole xAI thing has been a vehicle to undo Elons fuckup of selling Tesla shares to buy Twitter. He’s trying to end up with more Tesla ownership than he started with.
Who's bullish on "MechaHitler"?
Well said.
not if you do spac. Call your friend Chamath!
This will burn Teslas capital super fast, right? If he needs to keep on buying Nvidia shit. If he gives X investors Tesla stocks, if they have any brain cells, they will sell those asap, and that will also be bad for tsla. And on top of that X will not get much extra credit line. Either ways, i think this will be bad for tsla. It wont be as rosy as solar city.
Joke
Shouldn‘t the stock go down on a news like that? xAI is a cashburn machine and now he tries to put it under TSLA so he can sneak out more TSLA shared? Ah but wait, it‘s TSLA, any news pumps, I forgot. More calls.
Related point: The article says "Musk owns SpaceX". That is not true. He owns a slim majority of the shares and a large majority of the voting shares, but something like 46% of SpaceX is owned by others. Their money was looted to prop up XAI. Classic Musk corruption.
Believe it or not, Calls.
Don't forget that twitter was recently bought by XAI at face value. So this is Elon basically dunking his fuckup on tesla a public company just by wrapping it up smoothly with a shiny wrapper called AI.
You can’t really buy existing shares by issuing new shares of the same company. I think the xAI owners will make bank by receiving Tesla shares in exchange for theirs, then xAI will begin incinerating Tesla’s cash pile
Yes. That’s pretty how much how I think it will go down. He makes all his private investors whole and even gives them a huge profit , while the Tesla investors are left holding the bag.
Probably to have enough time to put together the deal.
He doesn’t really control the company directly. He still has goodwill with the right people in finance and silicon valley which is why he’ll probably be able to get this passed. Some of the institutional investors in Tesla no doubt have their hands in private equity as well and hold xAI shares. This move will allow them to cash out of those shares at the expense of retail.
Solarcity all over again. I’m all for it. Tesla taking on xAI would be hilarious. No reputable advertiser will go anywhere near it after the recent “hiccups”
> $30B has been burning a hole in their pockets for years and years. Bet you he still wants that $50+ billion payment that Delaware nixed on top of having Tesla bail out xAI.
So how does this work? xAI is Musk's personal company. And xAI purchases X (twitter) last year for about 45 billion. Basically book value and was just a consolidation of two companies he owned. No money exchanged. Now xAI has some book value of at least 45 billion on top of some intrinsic value he will assign to it. I bet upwards of 70 billion. Now everyone knows Musk way overpaid for Twitter. It might be worth 10 billion. And the intrinsic value of the AI portion is likely near zero in reality. More so, Tesla major investors and institutions started a lawsuit directly against Musk and a number of directors because Musk said if he does not get the 50 billion dollar stock payout, he will put all his efforts into his AI company. This is a quiet lawsuit as Tesla does not want their dirty laundry exposed but is well documented. So what Musk is now suggesting is Tesla needs AI. And guess what? He has an AI company that he spun up last year. A bloated one that has done near zero research to date and and weighed down with Twitter. A division that has zero to do with AI and no value to Tesl. So what he will be proposing is that Tesla buys a big portion of xAI. 50%??? And he Will have some 70 plus billion dollar value placed on it because .... he paid 45 billion for Twitter alone. So this 'investment' will be some big sum of money along with a bunch of Tesla shares and basically get Musk his money back of the big Twitter mess. If shareholders go for this, Musk deserves all their money. That is really all I can say. And Tesla itself. It will be spending billions in real money along with massive resources in some pointless direction. At a time when they do not have a new vehicle, or should say the one release has been a complete failure. And seeing worldwide declines.
xAI owns X (twitter) since last year. What makes you think Musk cares if it had enough money? There will be some intrinsic value placed on it. The Twitter merge would be valued at 45 billion alone. I bet the whole value will be 70 billion plus. Tesla maybe buys it outright or 50%, yet to be seen. The direct payments to Musk could be 50 billion. That would be in shares and likely a large sum of cash. On top of this, there would be some cash injection into X. For that 70 billion valuation, Tesla might get 5 billion of value and pay 50.
The deal will most certainly include cash (and shares) to the investors and some cash injection.
Didn’t Elon say just a few days ago that xAI wasn’t currently seeking new investments?
Major Tesla shareholders and institutions are suing Musk and some directors directly for just this. They at trying to keep it somewhat quiet but ya there has been resource tunneling to be sure. They are suing for precisely the creation of xAI. https://electrek.co/2025/04/10/cracks-are-forming-in-elon-musks-armor-of-lies/
It will be shares and cash to be sure. If shareholders go for this, Musk deserves every penny of their money. He really does.
It will be both to be sure. Likely cash injection into xAI as well.
There was no write-down nor would there be reason to do that. Believe there was some book value around 45 billion for the X (twitter) purchase. Likely what Twitter had for book value so as to not result in some tax component. On top of this, Musk will be putting an intrinsic value on the AI portion of that company. He can make that any amount he wants per se. Just has to sell that value to the shareholders. Details will most certainly be emerging but 70 billion.... 100 billion.... 200 billion... What do you think Shareholders would swallow?
xAI consists of an AI company recently spun up along with X (Twitter) that was more or less merged into it. The AI portion can not have any real value yet and we all know Twitter might be worth 10 billion. And with that 10 billion, believe there is about 10 billion in debt. xAI should have a real value of something between zero to 10 billion. Depends how you view the debt.
Ya very much so. The real plan is for Musk to get the maximum dollar from shareholders. That is it.
How can you say that? They are buying an AI company Musk owns. I mean is it important that they just spun up that company and then more or less merged Twitter into it? It has to be worth 200 billion by now. No?
Ignore oth trading. One person and very small trade can move that.
And after this deal Tesla will own part of Twitter. I don't see how this shell game can keep going when Tesla starts posting losses as well. The only company making money is SaceX and they have exploding rockets and have lost Starlink satellites, apparently 8 starship loads have been deorbited.
Beautiful! I sold tesler at a loss when I realized what an incredible douche bag that guy is, (with no regrets other than the fact that I ever supported him in the first place). . . And bought NVIDIA.
I'm pretty sure he promised xAI shares to refinance the debt on twitter.
With trump gutting affordable broadband spaceX truly has a great potential. Musk is not gonna touch it because that's gonna be his new cash cow. Tesla is gonna start posting losses starting next year so this is gonna be the last time he will be able to milk it for some time
Where do you get this info from ?
The richest man in the world doesn't have enough cash at hand to keep his AI/Social Media company afloat? The interesting part will be the valuation of xAI, when Tesla invests. Will it be based on any fundamentals? And we all know the answer to this question.
Like a factory falling over: https://youtu.be/oDzg1kRk09o
How do we know that SpaceX is actually earning Money? It’s a private Company that does not publish it’s financial Data. Starlink is highly expensive in upkeep as the Satellites have a very short life span. So they consistently have to launch new ones into space. But the amount of Customers on Earth is not really that big. Even in rural Africa there is 5G, which has faster download speeds than Starlink already. In the developed world, high speed Internet is provided via landlines with optical fibre. And people in remote areas without high speed Internet most often cannot afford the high prices for a starlink dish and a subscription. So maybe in the rural US there might be a slightly more broad potential Customer base. But that‘s about it and nearly not enough to make a veritable cash cow out of Starlink. As with every Musk Business, SpaceX is more of show and shine than actual substance.
Maybe he is a genius. The world's greatest grifter. Selling Monorails since 1993.
xAI isn’t even profitable, what’s the point?
Yeah I was shocked that the satellites only have a 5 year lifespan. Apparently a lot of them were cooked by recent solar flares that led to the recent auroras around the world. It doesn't seem like a good business model when you have to replace the entire satellite system every 5 years or sooner if there are intense solar flares.
They are earning money... from investors. lol
The taxpayer is also his piggy bank.
So went and dug up the numbers. Elon bought Twitter in 2022 for $44B. Offer was made around April, deal closed in October 2022. Fidelity was one of the banks that participated in the loans to Elon to fund the purchase, and took $19.66M of shares for collateral, they report their internal valuation regularly for their collateral, the numbers I found from October 2024 they put the same number of shares value at $4.2M putting fidelity’s implied value of Twitter at $9.4B. Of course Elon as controlling owner of both Twitter (as X) and xAI meant that he solely could buy out Twitter using xAI, it’s functionally just him merging two of his assets. In March 2025 he executed a deal where xAI “purchased” Twitter for $45B which that number was clearly chosen to not officially decrease twitters valuation on paper, but it was an all share deal, so I assume fidelity now holds collateral in xAI. I know a bunch of the banks that backed the loans weee getting pissed because they don’t usually like holding loans this large on their balance books for more than a year, and 2.5 years later they were still locked up - it wouldn’t surprise me if the xAI deal also facilitated some banks exits of the loan, probably by selling the debt back to Elon. The current funding round that’s started this whole story was originally pitched at a $200B valuation, and then he had SpaceX put in $2B at a $113B valuation after a couple weeks when he’s clearly been coming up short. So now suddenly he’s talking about Tesla participating. None of these valuations are reasonable since he can’t even get third parties to participate fully.
They will vote for anything he says....idiots.
Yes, the X + xAI merger was the one I referenced above that only happened in March this year - 4 months ago. All the numbers from that deal were funny numbers, but as of October 2024 Fidelity who held some X/Twitter loans had an implied value on X/Twitter of $9.4B, and had been making regular >20% write-downs on the value since the original purchase.
Just for optics. In case stockholders refuse, he'll simply invest using SpaceX's money, where he doesn't need to ask anyone.
Dude should be in jail for fraud.
I thought Solar City was owned by a cousin?
How did money go from spacex to xai?
You can, but it is highly sus and you basically need criminal insider, absolute idiot or palpable desperation inside a bank. In practice usually little bit of all of the elements mentioned before. You make a russian nesting doll of companies and use convertible loans to capitalize them. Not something mr. Musk is total stranger towards either.
TSLA shareholders? Oh, they're used to swallowing whatever Musk tells them to.
What about us lazy slobs?
Right. So Tesla buys xAI and it converts to Tesla stock
That's the Musk business plan for all his companies. Promise the world in the next 12 months and never deliver. It's a lot like Trump really except he does 2 weeks.
You'll be given cushy jobs!
That's how you know they're definitely seeking new investments
That sounds about right. I was using some napkin calculations from numbers i remember a year back. More so, I was being somewhat optimistic at a 70 billion valuation. LOL. 200 billion??? Brand new AI company with Twitter baggage. All I have to say is Tesla shareholders deserve to give all their money to Musk if this is approved.
He's building Russian nesting dolls of bullshit to hide his losses (See Solar City) and foisting it on everyone's 401K.
It’s also a way to try to keep Morgan Stanley whole.
Oh god. Do I want to know what’s going on there?
Just looked, seems like Morgan Stanley is marketing a $5B loan on best efforts only and not underwriting it at all. Also they slapped a 12% interest rate on it. Hahahaha. At least they learnt their lesson to never hold the bag for Elon
They loaned musk money.
Reuters reported that Morgan Stanley managed to exit their loan earlier this year on the back of Elons rise in popularity after the election.
Banks always win.
And remember Grok is powered by mobile turbines (intended to run emergency power) that lack [pollution controls.](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/naacp-files-intent-to-sue-elon-musks-xai-company-over-memphis-supercomputer-air-pollution) So much for teslas mission statement. It was a lie
Exactly. And any market that Starlink has now will slowly erode over time as 5G/6G or whatever the next land-based alternative is eventually reaches those customers. At its most recent funding valuation ($400 billion), it's even more overvalued than Tesla now.
There's a lot of different contradicting constraints that Starlink is fighting against, IIRC regarding low latency, low power consumption, and high coverage, that mean the satellites have to operate at a fairly low altitude. I believe starlink operates in the range of 360 and 500 kilometers above sea level. Which is in the same ballpark as the ISS, which experiences constant minor atmospheric drag that requires reboosting from time to time to remain in orbit. Starlink satellites do have reboosting capability, using their ion thrusters. This is also how they rise to operating altitude after deployment into LEO. But again, they're subject to constant, subtle, drag.
Trump gutted affordable broadband . . . in rural areas. Low population density, and low income. It's certainly a boon for musk, but there's a ceiling to what he can expect to make off of it.
True. But I am sure there were some stressful months for the idiot VPs who approved the deal while they watched Elon attempt to burn their collateral to the ground - as evident by them refusing to underwrite this new loan they’ve taken to market for him.
I hope they approve it. This will hasten the demise of Tesslerr.
GOOD!
Like an idiot I thought holding TSLA meant I had skin in the game of xAI, am I wrong didn't EM at one point say Tesla was an AI company hence its crazy high valuation?
"It’s not up to me" Hahaha
I find it impressive how you all relish on the hope that someone fails without even reflecting one second on what that means for your own life.
It would make no sense, because xAI is about textual prediction based on documents. How would that help a car be safer or smarter? It wouldn't. Self-driving cars need sensor data, not word prediction. Is the snoozing car driver or safety driver riding shotgun going to give verbal corrections in real-time to avoid accidenst? It makes no sense. Teslas are not competitive anymore against other EVs, esp. the Chinese EVs, and everyone hates Musk. It's a desperate move by a desperate con man (and drug addict).
Login is required to comment.
Login with Google