The terrifying truth about why Tesla’s cars keep crashing

All hype and little research is what Tesla's appear to be. Moving fast and breaking things when we are talking about 4+ ton vehicles tends to be lives and property being broken, not antiquated business models.

TLDR: Nothing really new here, Musk lies and Tesla’s are orders of magnitude more dangerous than Tesla lets on. People die. Also Tesla doesn’t fully cooperate with data sharing and is largely full of shit.

So stock up what 10%? I don't even know where the money to prop this up is coming from any more?

4+ ton? Which car is that?

Yup. Greatest stock scam in the history of the world. Pure vaporware relative to the valuation. Yes, this many people can be wrong for this long. It’s incredible to witness in real time.

Every time there was a crash for years Elon would say, Aha! Autopilot was off! They are liars who don't want to pay for their mistake. Then it was revealed the autopilot/FSD just turns itself off right before the crash so they can blame the user. The Tesla cult would then double down on this and proclaim everyone was just a scammer who was driving the wrong way, etc.

and spacex

A real car avonds crashes, even with the adaptive Cruise off.

It’s hard for me to keep trying to explain but basically so many investors tied up people’s 401k’s to the company it makes everyone seem incompetent if the stock goes down. It’s all ego and “I can’t be wrong” bs keeping the stock alive. It’s more institutional investors than retail at the moment I’m pretty sure; so basically if you’re a normal person stay the f away unless you want to be exit liquidity in the future.

Good point, this will only crash if it continues with sales decline across the globe, closure of factories and continuing brain drain. I think a huge catalyst could be the squeeze out of China. Europe demand collapse is already price in I guess.

Cyber truck is 3 ton plus 1.1 ton load in the bed Even if it were legal in the EU, it would be too heavy to be driven with a car licence which has a 3.5 ton MAM https://www.german-driving-licence.com/categories That's why most vans like Mercedes sprinters and similar all have a MAM just under 3.5 tons so companies and rental firms have a much easier time as they can be driven with a normal car licence which most people have.

My Leaf is 1,500kg and can tow a ton. That does not make it a 2.5 ton car!

He did not talk about towing…

I have been saying it for months. Tesla is a much bigger scam than Enron. Elon alongside his army of trolls, influencers and Wall Street friends keep pumping the stock through endless lies. FSD isn’t a real product. Optimus is years away, if at all. Tesla is probably worth $100 bn and not $1 trillion.

I have been saying it for months. Tesla is a much bigger scam than Enron. Elon alongside his army of trolls, influencers and Wall Street friends keep pumping the stock through endless lies. FSD isn’t a real product. Optimus is years away, if at all. Tesla is probably worth $100 bn and not $1 trillion

Fair. Ok my Leaf can carry five fat adults. It’s still not a 2 ton car.

No it can’t, the maximum allowed load for a Nissan Leaf depending on model is between 384 and 490kg. Also, what’s your point - are you trying to say BEVs aren’t heavy devices to be handled with care? Because that was the point he made before you started splitting hairs… ;)

Genuine question though, If your car fully loaded weighs 2 tons and you drive it fully loaded, then what else is it if not a 2 ton car?

Well normally there is only one fat adult in it. So 1.6 tons.

My question remains, what production Tesla weighs 4 tons? So far the answer has been a cybertruck with a ton in the bed.  I do not find that answer satisfactory.

Tesla Semi.12.25 tons. Happy?

I suppose.  Fine. Where can I buy one?

Institutions bailed and retail stayed is the narrative I have heard

The Guardian is a serious "newspaper" (showing my age here). This is a serious and well written article. Whether new news or old info isn't the important thing to remember. The more of these that drip, drip, drip out into the public consciousness, ala wikileaks style, the closer we are to T$LA's demise and the closer we are to fElon becoming a Felon. I love reading the doom and gloom here, don't get me wrong. But my parents don't read the realtesla subreddit. They do read The Guardian. Full disclosure: current MY owner (130k miles)

Haha can't argue with that.

Very good point.  And doubly so since I think there would have been a lot of overlap between Guardian readers and the Telsa ownership in the UK

I wonder if the Autopilot turning off is real or if the data was manipulated after a crash detection to make it look like Autopilot turned off. They could have some computer code to go through the data recorded and change the state of the Autopilot to off at one second before a crash.

Or just every “file” just ends with auto pilot being off. Most users won’t notice and is prolly how most people drive when coming home.

Omfg that was an engaging piece of article. Shady af. I will stay the f away from any Tesla I see from now on. Wtfffff

With enough liquidity and a concerted effort, a group of very rich people/institutions can quite easily manipulate a stock's price via the options market. Just like you hear about things like gold being manipulated to the down side (ie price suppression), you can manipulate a stock to the upside (but the only ones with enough money to do this are governments, banks, and the oligarchs). I really don't think there's an army of retail fanbois out there. I think this is big money keeping one of their own (Elon) from crashing and burning.

They don't even need to do that. Autopilot will basically hand control to the driver whenever it notices anything wrong. During collisions the problem is that the car usually doesn't notice anything untill it's waaaaayyyy too late. But it will notice at least a fraction of a second before the collision. It's that fraction of a second where you know you're you're about to be in a collision and there's nothing you can do. Remember if Autopilot disengages 0.015 seconds before the collision, it was not engaged at the moment of collision. If they wanted to be honest, they would log the first three seconds after Autopilot disengaged. But they didn't. So Tesla saying "Autopilot was turned off at the time of the collision" really just means Elon's a lying piece of shit. They also don't do a good enough job explaining that Autopilot is not self driving. But that's a seperate issue entirely.

Since TSLA is in the S&P 500 and other broad based market cap weighted indeces, retirement plans and other institutions that invest in indeces are automatically buying and holding the position, agnostic to the merits of the company. It won’t get sold till it drops out of the index. By then, it will have participated in the ride down in price. It’s just not that big of a deal since they are investing in 499 other companies too. I just don’t believe there are too many active institutional investors proactively buying TSLA, but the passive ones definitely are, every two weeks on pay day.

Tesla making the cheapest possible car with the shittiest materials, skimping on budget servers and calling it "nEuRaL nEtWoRk" while using even shittier software will guarantee crashes. Hilarious to see all the constant "FSD" posts of tesla fuckups

Politicians and government authorities are failing the public. These vehicles operate on publicly owned roads created and maintained by taxes. We should be insisting on transparency and accountability and Musk blocking this should be met with appropriate laws.

It possibly explains why Musk is stubbornly holding a tight reign on Tesla - he's fearful that if he's not in charge, information will get out showing him culpable in the deaths of many people.

In the video where youtuber drove through wild coyote wall FSD turned of fractions of the second before it hit.

Tesla has been using mode confusion as a marketing tool and defect defense ever since AP was first introduced.

> $100 bn You’re forgetting about the liability of a decade of lies about the capabilities of their products.

Had a model 3 from 2018. Every once in a while the car would accelerate out of nowhere even when the autopilot was off. I ended up being a little nervous when pulling the car out of the garage as a shifting would seem to cause it the most times. Meaning going from reverse to drive, all of a sudden you would get acceleration after lifting your foot from the brake which was required to shift. Never caused a crash but spooked me a few times.

There’s very few stocks with an option market as robust and liquid as tesla’s. The meme stocks with no rhyme or reason for their valuations like tsla, pltr, mstr, spy, are simply vehicles for flipping options.

Tesla is Elon and vice versa, the whole thing is a scam which is why they cannot deliver fully on the promises they have made or even the targets they set.

Opposite actually. Retail can’t hold the price so high on their own. Not many people give a damn about Tesla it’s just they need to keep the appearance from the outside looking in. Because quite frankly they’d be the bag holders if it went to zero and that’s usually not the case.

Whaddya mean, Full Self Driving is not full self driving?

The door handle thing is almost as disturbing as the fake Full Self Driving thing

Would that make Tesla a potential baby killer?

As long as millions of rich people in the world worship Elon Musk, Tesla stock price will keep climbing up. Sometimes rich people don't care money spent or wasted as long as they have plenty.

Exactly. Every lie that passes fElon’s lips should carry a measurable price.

If only we had a national highway transportation safety agency.

TLDR: Autopilot is only for highways, and you still have to pay attention. Full self driving or SFD, is end to end, but you still need to pay attention. Full self driving also costs thousands of dollars and is in closed beta at the moment. Autopilot is a tier below full self driving. It will keep you in your lane and keep your speed, maybe pass someone for you, but it doesn't navigate end to end for you. You still need to pay attention, you can't nap in the car. Tesla has been taking several thousands of dollars from people for FSD. If you buy FSD you get 1. car summon for parking lots, 2. stopping at stop signs and streetlight, 3. Enhanced autopilot (whatever that is), 4. the ability to APPLY to the true FSD beta. Full self driving is a beta you need to apply where they only accept if you're a safe driver according to their monitoring. You still need to pay attention because it still needs work. Tesla has been caught purposely targeting areas where video creators use FSD, and they still need to intervene regularly.

The name is highly misleading, basically means the opposite of what it actually is. Full. Self. Driving. The fine print is the opposite of the plain language meaning of the words.

This is easy to look up - 50% held by institutions. That's not that high. Compare that to Apple: 63%, Google: 81%, Uber: 84% (just picked 3). Retail is also what drives Tesla's volatility and illogical swings.

As with $mstr and the Bitcoin infinite money glitch, it works until it doesn't.

After reading the article, you guys excited to join he "America" party? Yeah, me neither. No? Well, maybe support ranked-choice voting then, to loosen the death grip of the party duopoly.

38 billion in cash

> stopping at stop signs and streetlight which is def a lie because i've seen countless clips where fsd doesn't acknowledge red lights, stop signs, yield signs, and speed bumps, speeds right through everything. thanks for the explanation

"Musk has taken that mindset to the road. The world is his lab. Everyone else is part of the experiment."

It can't even do the summoning right in the first place.

>If they wanted to be honest, they would log the first three seconds after Autopilot disengaged. But they didn't. But they do. Saying they don't fits your narrative though.

It’s not a closed beta

And simps think it’s not real

And what got it into the S&P in the first place

Yeah, but it’s aneurysm inducing to see people defend the mistakes and try to justify them

I was barely able to take over on a trip where FSD tried to take an off ramp under construction. 100 percent certain we would have died had I not been able to correct at the last second. I was paying attention but at 75 mph it can be hard to make the correction. Will never own a Tesla again.

The list of extradition treaties with countries that will want to have a conversation is going to be quite long.

Nothing new. Chancellor Musk goes after anyone who raises safety concerns rather than fix the safety concern. [Elon Musk Tried To 'Destroy' A Whistleblower, Spies On Employees And Unions: Report](https://www.jalopnik.com/elon-musk-tried-to-destroy-a-whistleblower-spies-on-em-1833264505/)

Look, I hate Musk as much as the next guy. He deserves to be lambasted for that snarky nasty attitude. But I've driven the Tesla enough to say: self driving basically works. Sorry. I know how fun it is to bash it and by proxy him, but it's actually the most amazing piece of tech I have ever experienced. It's more of a jump than the iPhone. You really don't have to drive! Yes, you have to pay attention, and therein lies the rub (and yes, Musk's over-promising in a life or death area). I dislike this person sufficiently that even though I wanted a Tesla, I could not see myself giving the company he runs (and to whatever extent him) my money. So I got a Prius. But I've kinda had it with the narrative that it's all bs and a cover up. I've done it. It's a thing. I can't wait until I can do it. It makes driving an entirely different experience. It makes LA traffic non-hellish! I love not having to drive. But I have nonetheless forsaken it. And I'm not really that virtuous a person. I have given Jeff Bezos my money. And I sure gave Bill Gates and Steve Jobs my money. So I helped the world burn and participated in the horror that will destroy life as we know it. I am part of the problem. But I just don't know how to leave this world, so I make those compromises, and try to make up for it in other ways. But I have a line. As attractive, and, in my view, as truly functional, as "FSD" - as it currently is - is, I will do without it so as not to support a business run by a Nazi.

Do you have a Tesla? Are you using FSD?

Are you using FSD? What is your real feeling when you using FSD?

The real name should be something like *partial or limited supervised "assistance"*. At best it's more *edge-of-your-seat* babysitting that "assistance". I have no idea how elong has gotten away with this wording for so long without being sued into oblivion when it's blatant fraud.

Hear, hear! I’ll drink to that! Also results in candidates getting selected by the voting populace who scare the party demagogues and power brokers to death. Cf. NYC likely mayor Mandani. Who actually said things the PEOPLE wanted to hear. I hope he can get even a fraction of them done, swimming against the political machine.

And that’s the problem. It probably does work, a lot of the time. If you compare the number of incidents to the total number of hours driven, it’s probably still a pretty low percentage. The problem here is that he’s touted it as closer to zero, and that’s not true. I once had an Oldsmobile - a car I really liked. The anti-lock braking system (then, fairly new tech - it was decades ago) was great…until one day, one time, when I tried to apply the brakes and they didn’t work. It was on an icy road, and luckily I wasn’t moving very fast, so I slid into the car in front of me at slow motion and didn’t even dent her bumper. My husband wouldn’t believe me. He assumed it was my driving mistake and that I was trying to cover up. Until it happened to him. Two years later. In a parking lot, on dry pavement, in the summer. Shook him up more than a little - and he reluctantly had to agree that I was right, there was something wrong with the car’s ABS system. But because it happened so rarely, it was not a fault they could ever have found. A system doesn’t have to be bad all the time, or even a substantial majority of the time. It can be perfect for 1,000 hours straight - but if the 30 seconds when it DOES malfunction causes an accident, that’s all that’s required to show it does not, in fact, work AS ADVERTISED. And the apparent number of times the safety routine for extending the door handles fails is frankly terrifying. I can think of very few “quick” deaths that would be more awful than burning alive while rescuers watched helplessly. Now, it’s a good idea to carry window breakers in any car, because electric windows will fail if you somehow go off the road into deep water; but no car company has advertised or claimed that they will work in every situation.

No need to go there bro - the factual data on FSD is abundant and not good. Something that works even 99% of time means your house is without power for 3.5 days a year, or a lot of people get killed if you’re driving cars around with camera based tech. It’s an irreparably faulty base that can’t recover from regardless of BS spin.

So are these stories of FSD errors lies?

it almost smashed the cybertruck into the car in front of it in Feb of this year. the camera had road salt on it and kept on autopiloting and ignored the vehicle. I had to slam on the brakes

Seems like blatant fraud is A-OK these days

I'm guessing no. The ones I've seen, like the last big one, guy was driving directly into the sun, the road had some unexpected block and so cars were piled up, I would not expect my FSD to handle anything the world throws at it, and not that. I probably would have taken over. As I tend to do when things turn sketchy. The mild argument against Musk is that he futzes with the data and over represents what the car can really do. Sounds like the Musk I know. But the harder argument that FSD is a scam and doesn't work and people are dying right and left, I don't see that being proved. You have to monitor the thing, yes. Does it fail sometimes? Sure. But less than human error. Is Musk an asshole and does he cheat? Yes. Indeed, he is a misanthrope masquerading as a savior. But if you show me data that his system is unfit for human use, I can show you data that shows that it is. Given the flaws and how we collect the data and communicate about it, I don't see how we can transcend that level of confirmation bias.

Only if you're punching down. Companies can sell boneless chicken wings with bones. But fib slightly on a welfare application and watch out.

Full Self Deception?

I had a 2021 Model 3. I noticed that regenerative braking would occasionally suddenly become “limited” on downhill roads causing the car to accelerate. Then suddenly when I was on the freeway in traffic it accelerated so quickly that I thought I’d been rear ended, and I slammed into the car in front of me before I could apply the brake. I was not in autopilot. I was shocked to see there wasn’t a single scratch on my rear bumper after pulling over. I took the car into Tesla after it was repaired to have everything checked and they informed me that there was nothing wrong with the car. I asked if I could get any data about what happened with the acceleration that caused the crash and they said that they didn’t have any data from the crash. A few months after the crash there was a new setting - apply braking when regenerated braking “is limited”. 😤

The dumbasses who trust fsd deserve everything that comes to them. I tested it out in my neighborhood but I’m not dumb enough to use it in busy areas. It’s just a gimmick/party trick to show off. You dumbasses who use it everyday and cry when accidents happen deserve the hell they belong in. Tesla makes a damn good EV put 75k on a 18 model 3. 12v batt left me stranded in parking lot had it fixed by Tesla that day for 150 and wear and tear items was all I had to do. Just got a 25 model 3 and haven’t even touched fsd.