🤞🏼Praying us HW3 owners get a hardware upgrade!!!

it would be great, but i'm not holding my breath. one step at a time... patiently waiting as robotaxi rollout is underway and then we will see. until then, looking forward to v14 lite on my model 3 rwd lr with hw3.

I upgraded cars from HW3 to HW4 and it’s a huge improvement Edit: I bought a new car, that’s how

Would be sick if HW3 could at least get GROK and the new UI… I understand if the hardware can’t run the latest self driving software, but damn. Give us something.

V14 light would be something to experiment with while they get unsupervised dialed in. It will take time but I still think HW3s can be unsupervised someday.

I have Grok on my 2023. I Long press the R toggle wheel on the steering wheel to open it.

You can have HW3 and still get Grok and UI. The difference is what infotainment processor you have Intel/Ryzen.

Intel processor? No way

Understood, yes, you’re correct. My mistake

Ryzen I believe

Some 2023 cars already had Ryzen.

Even some 2022

What’s the advantage of having Grok? I don’t even use it. What am I missing?

How?

It's easy. You just buy a new car!

[deleted]

Jan. of 2023 is when mine was manufactured.

Then use it. Talk to it in natural language rather than specific prompts. I do “Can you find pizza places near me? No, look for pizza only 2 miles away or look for pizza that offer spicy flavor only”.

You spent 8k on FSD for HW3??? Holy smokes lol the discretionary income is discrestiinjng

Just go test drive one dude, it actually drives itself unlike HW3. Source: I’ve owned both

The CPU can’t run it

Voice commands only recognizes specific commands. You can talk to Grok like a person. It helps you find things in the area (food/c-store, etc.) and can put the route in the navigation for you.

You press a button tell it where you want to go and it drives you there or it’s just another way of using AI like on your phone if you don’t have FSD

Let’s see if we in the eu can still buy it after 14. There was 0 information for the eu about this.

Most 22s will have ryzen. Switch was made mid Jan 2022

I said the same thing when everyone was talking about it at first. Hard to think of an example. It’s not like it changed my life, it’s just sorta convenient to get an answer for something when I think of it

yeah, this is likely as the new vehicles have bumper cameras

You'll be surprised how good V12 is lol

It's not a $50,000 improvement lmfao. My paid off performance is chilling

V13 owners hate this one simple trick!

My HW3 drove me from central Oregon to central California with multiple stops at parks and I only ever took over to back into a charging stall, or to park. So, are you sure you had FSD V12 in your HW3? Edit: when I had a HW4 rental the only major difference was confidence, lack of speed control, and parking at destination which weirdly HW3 parked at destination for me yesterday.

Why would you ever entertain this in the EU?

Sometimes I ask about the news, and a lot of times it can't even tell me anything relevant that isn't 2 days old so I have to ask again. I haven't touched grok in weeks.

$8k on a prayer?

It probably cheaper for them to discount a hw5 car. Waste of engineering effort. Probably done with their summer interns

Intel doesn't have it, but it should the processing power isn't on the cpu lol

I confirm this, I received mine November 2021 and got ducked

My wife and I will be in the car talking about a subject, and we have a question that we would normally Google. Now we just ask Grok. It’s pretty cool.

For my situation it's worth every penny in its current form. Any improvements will be just "icing on the cake"

I bought my 2019 M3P with FSD last April, and I love it! It works like magic as far as I’m concerned, so if we ever get upgraded, I’ll be stoked. But frankly from all I’ve read on this forum, it seems like nothing but complaints about the latest version😂. My only complaint about H3 is the summons function. It’d be sweet if it worked in the real world, but it’s mostly a party trick to show friends

Ya I just realized yesterday I couldn’t install Grok on my 2019 M3P. Bummer

What does "discrestiinjng" mean? I am not familiar with the term...

I love the optimism’s but HW3 will never have unsupervised. I’m not even convinced HW4 will either. Neither will be upgraded for free. The best case will be a class action where you’ll submit a form saying you were affected and you’ll get $21.75 back lmfao.

I'm hopeful like OP, but won't hold my breath. To my understanding upgrading HW3 to HW4 requires new cameras, wiring, harnesses, etc. ...something that if became available Tesla would charge the price of another car for.

For me it's working better than Google. "hey what's the song from that movie where the guy runs around the big hous naked at the end" and it knew what I meant. For people with no ability to remember things, it's a huge benefit.

Is transfer allowed these days when you buy a new car?

You dont need to spend 50k. Sell the HW3 car and buy a HW4 is more like ... 5-10k.

I ask it random shit all the time. I love getting instant answers to things I’m curious about.

*14

Heard somewhere that FSD transfer to new vehicle ends March 31.

I honestly can’t say the experience is much better than autopilot on HW3.

You paid $8k for a hope and prayer?

about 30k for me. 22 to 26 M3P. 0% APR and 0 down though. I invested the difference so not too bad.

Isn’t the $100 a month the same thing. Why opt into $8k, you plan on having it for over 7 more years or does it transfer to a new purchased Tesla I the future

I strongly doubt it. I'm not even sure HW4 will be able to do it effectively.

I'm a performance owner, anything less is a downgrade. It's $55k and due to the terrible resale value mines only like $25k now. Not worth it. Id rather invest the money and drive my car for 10 + years

I bought my 2018 with Enhanced Autopilot ($5K) back then and had upgraded to FSD with HW3 upgrade when first offered for $2K (had HW2.5 at purchase). The new cameras alone were worth it and I didn’t use FSD back then at all. Didn’t feel comfortable with state of it back then and watched as it improved. So I paid $7K total for full package. My husband couldn’t understand why buy it as FSD back then was so less reliable. I have kept my cars long term so was gambling the $2K someday would pay off. My husband uses it now most of the time when driving my car. It’s really pretty good (still needs and should be monitored). Enhanced Autopilot was worth having for $5K on the car. FSD for $2K more for what we get now worth it too. If you were buying a new car now and having to spend $8 upfront it would be a big one time hit, but I don’t think you can still just buy Enhanced Autopilot which was very useful. I’ll just say my guy likes it and uses it enough that he just bought the FSD upgrade for his 2024 MS. If you don’t keep your car for a few years you still might think about buying it for resale purposes since it will still be transferable to new owner. Otherwise month to month.

[deleted]

Welcome to the hw3 fsd club. If it works for you, then don't feel bad at all! Just enjoy it

I paid $8k to have FSD for the life of the car without paying a monthly sub. A hardware upgrade would be just an added bonus.

Grok is not an incentive for me. Don’t like having devices listening. We do however use triggered voice commands on occasion.

Thanks!!! I'm happy as can be .... No $99/mo sub and I pretty much have a chauffeur for the lifetime of the car. It may not be for everyone but it's perfect for me..

I use it a couple times a week to answer questions that cross my mind during a drive. And I appreciate that. I’ve even asked it silly things like what is the 0–60 time for the car next to me. Lol It’s also gotten a little better at finding destinations for map guidance. Not perfect, but it’s gotten better.

I paid for FSD two years ago, and you have it, I got zip, and paid much, much, much more than you. I am angry and jealous :D

I wasn’t aware that it listens all the time. My impression is that it doesn’t listen until you hit the button. And then it only listens until you shut it off. Which is perfect for me.

I plan on having it a while. Currently FSD can be transferred to a new vehicle but I think that is ending March 31.

can you say hey grok, play that song from the movie .... on spotify?

But wait wouldn't that upgrade be for the OGs that have purchased full FSD before they switched the name to FSD supervised (like it says in your receipt). Does anyone have receipts to compare? I don't know but I have a funny feeling that Tesla is going to be sneaky with that and only honor the ones that paid before the whole "FSD Beta" to "Supervised" name change.

It already ended worldwide. Exact dates dependent on country/region.

Talking about a car with similar kilometers and so on

I take it as a good sign that Tesla is even allowing HW3 to purchase FSD. I don't think they would do that if they viewed HW3 as a complete dead end.

Anything is possible. Maybe the OGs will be prioritized and offered upgrade first? We shall see...

Agree!

If you could transfer to another vehicle at the end of the 6 years owning it, I'd be interested but without it, $100 a month seems more cost effective.

Fair point

Oh okay. So what I’m gathering is it does absolutely nothing that would benefit me. 😂 Thanks for letting me know. I don’t need to know where anything is where I live. I’m lived here for years.

What's the likelihood that insurance would pay out the added value of FSD if the car were to be written off?

😅

I ask about space stuff a lot. Maybe once a week or so. I have an hour commute each way - sometimes I just wanna know more about black holes.

It has been indicated that it will increase in price as capabilities improve.

That's how it works now. There's no evidence that Grok is listening at all times.

Guy was so surprised, he stroked out before he could finish typing

What you mean by “new cameras”? Do they upgrade 2.5 cameras along with computer upgrade?

make more money

It’s good for navigating. “Take me to the nearest public restroom, park, movie theater, etc.” I use it mainly for “take me to Costco.”

Pretty sure Elon said the same thing before they changed FSD from $15k to 8k… cant trust anything he says. Like, at all.

I think the bumper cam on HW4 is more for replacing the ultrasonic sensors. But I'd really like side-facing bumper cams for when it's peeking out into traffic to make a turn.

Fact 

But if I didn’t have FSD, it can’t take me anywhere. 😂

It won't play it (I've argued with grok about how tesla needs to get their stacks a little more organized) but apparently that's going to be possible eventually.

Jesus horrible decision. Refund this immediately! You'll need to keep the car at least 80 months to breakeven and won't be able to transfer it. Just subscribe when you want to.

Sorry to burst your bubble but HW3 will probably only be getting V14 Lite. HW4 is awesome right now. Can’t wait to see what HW5 will be like. Hopefully by next year.

I don’t understand why in the situation they do spend the cash to develop a 3->4 upgrade, they wouldn’t offer the option to non FSD owners to upgrade for a price. Thus I’m not giving them a dime till I have confirmation I can run the latest and greatest on my 2021 M3LR.

I was always surprised there were no diagonal facing cams at the front bumper

I'm seriously thinking about replacing my 2019 M3 with a current one while we can still transfer the permanent FSD license...

If they’re even accurate.

And I hear Apple is also offering iPhone 10 owners CPU upgrades! /s

Yeah 8000 is about 7yrs worth of FSD, assuming current subs pricing. I would go with 100/month if it can't be transferred to a new car.

Right make more money and buy a HW4 instead of obsolete tech. Thanks for the backup

I was able to get Grok to tell me what company currently owned the abandoned factory near my house and how much it was roughly valued at with sources and references Something that would have taken me a good amount of time to look up myself vs getting the answer with sources in seconds I use Gemini a lot for work and sometimes copilot agents I have set up and it is challenging to articulate all the ways I use it

You won’t lol

Not until it’s unsupervised which is a regulatory battle not technological

Yes the cameras from my September 2018 build were HW2.5 and everything was upgraded to HW3, board and all cameras. Noticed immediate improvement in camera quality. My car was among the last few pre-orders when the car came out as I ordered an AWD LR model, almost fully upgraded features at the time. Also just got in to be grandfathered for free life-time connectivity too. It’s been a great car with just basic normal wear needing done, like tires and AC filter.

I also have a 2018 M3 RWD with EAP from around the same timeframe so wondering if I will really see improvements worth spending for. It still has the old Intel chip so probably not major UI improvements but cameras will be nice.

aah FFS, some thing actually useful, and easy to do, nah too hard.

Praying always works so congratulations! /s

I’ve held on to my 2018 AWD LR and honestly am very happy with it so much so that I still plan to keep for many years. I have low mileage and from what I keep hearing the HV batteries can last for way more miles than I’d likely ever put on it. I’ll battery test it soon in March and then once more before November’s 8-year warranty expiration. It’s likely I buy the 2-yr whatever extended battery?? warranty for $2K. As a owner of purchased FDS, it will stay with the car should I resell it at some point. I think having FSD will make it more desirable and useable for someone else. I did fully body wrap and ceramic on the car at delivery so my car honestly looks still new. Elon has said FSD won’t be available after 2/14/2026 to buy. He also indicated that FSD month to month will be going up as it gets even more advanced. He’s also said at some point all Teslas will be cyber cabs and presumably bought to use for that purpose. I have no interest in that and want to own my car outright for my own driving convenience purpose. Who knows what Elon will do as CEO down the road. He seems less interested in selling individual cars and instead I think preferring selling fleets of his cyber cabs. At one time I thought he said he’d sell all his Tesla shares to pour into his occupying Mars obsession. He also said FSD was only a one-time upgrade offer and we’ve seen him play with different incentives to boost sales at end of quarter. Since I just don’t see him that invested any more in selling EV cars to individuals, I’m glad to have bought FSD. We are a two Tesla home with Tesla solar panels, PWs and fairly long time shareholders but I can’t say given what I hear about his plans for the company that my next car will be a Tesla. My husband is on his second MS and apparently last one. He does not want to drive a Model Y. Doesn’t leave him much choice come his next car.

Damn that doesn’t seem fair for people who bought it prior. Unless it only applies to people who will buy it after March

If it’s something significant, I ask Grok and GPT then compare answers. lol

I use it to do multiple destinations. “Navigate to a Lowes, then to a Target on my way home.” It’s awesome at stuff like that.

I think you can still use it to get it to route plan for you

Kind of funny if that is the case as getting rid of the sensors was supposed to be a cost cutting measure. I would expect the camera to be more expensive.

That doesn’t mean it won’t ever come back. It was never a permanent offer to transfer fsd. It was a promotional tool to get more trade ins and sales on new vehicles at the end of a quarter

Look it's your money but that doesn't make any sense. You'd have to keep the car a very, very long time to justify. Even if you said "F it I'm getting it anyway," smart money would be buying a used car that already had it. I bought my HW3 X with FSD from a reseller that didn't price it in.

Aren’t they piloting unsupervised HW4 model Ys in Austin right now? Unless the results from that are disastrous I imagine it will slowly lead to unsupervised

HW3 owner who loves his v12.6.4. I subscribe. But I definitely don't see a hardware upgrade getting us to something close to v14. Maybe a software fix that can get us close. But v12.6.4 is good...as long as you haven't been previously spoiled by v14

Hey don’t ever not fill those out. I got one for a hospital I took my son to for a checkup and got some notice about a cyber data breach for each of us, filled it out and got $333x3. Also got it before going out to dinner, ate like a king 🤣

[deleted]

Elaborate? Are you saying they aren’t piloting in Austin?

I meant to edit not delete lmao…I think they’re still a person in the taxi.

From what I’ve seen they are running about a dozen robo taxis that are completely unsupervised - I believe it’s extremely geofenced and basically following a bus route right now but it’s entirely unsupervised - just picking up passengers in the back. I have to think they’ll eventually increase the area and routes it’s doing and these improvements will have to come our way eventually. I think the robo taxis are on the HW 4.5 kit that the newer Ys are shipping with

I can’t believe there hasn’t been a class action lawsuit yet. There are many times that he has said that the original hardware would take us all the way to level five. Just another one of his lies. And the fact that they aren’t actively doing anything besides trying some of the software improvements is such a disappointment.

We won't.

If he gave FSD away for $1000 I think he’d hit his milestone quickly.

Yep.

*to have FSD for the life of the car*  This is precisely why I decided against it. The life of the car could be another 5-7 years, or it could be another 5-7 minutes depending entirely on how others drive.

Listen….I’m rooting for them! I’m just being realistic.

Afaik there was no camera upgrade from 2.5 to hw 3. The camera picture quality upgrade was coming from the better image post processing of the hw3

I think it all comes down to people who can spend $99 for the enhanced connectivity, they would find it value and people who can't or refused to spend $100, wouldn't find any values in AI connectivity.

Doubt. There will probably be a class action lawsuit at some point . We will get about $40 back .

You wont. No firmware update is going to replace hardware. In reality, to replace every Model 3 HW3 with HW4 would cost Tesla an absurd amount of money that they don’t have to spend.

They just want your money

Break even point is like 7 years. You think the car will last that long?

Congrats! I’m not one of those people who will say you could have invested 8k in so and so because it doesn’t work like that in the real world. Regular people spend money on 8k watches and purses. Only to use it once or twice and hide them away. As long as you’re happy then that’s all that matters. I just bought FSD two days ago too.

Not much time left to buy for the $2K. See above post I made about new cameras installed for HW2.5 owners. I think your car with just RWD had an earlier production date than mine so would have the HW2.5 cameras. The sticker on your driver side door area will have the production date on it. Mine was 09/2018.

this is a fantasy. get real.

I swear, without money he is just a flim-flam man.

Actually wrong. This is what Tesla offered to HW2.5 owners like me. I had wait quite a while for my service appt but it was worth it. “Camera Replacement for Model 3 with Hardware 2.5 Eligibility for Camera Replacement Camera Replacement for Model 3 with Hardware 2.5. Eligibility for Camera Replacement Owners of Tesla Model 3 vehicles equipped with Hardware 2.5 may be eligible for complimentary camera replacements. This offer is specifically for vehicles that have early production cameras. Availability of Camera Replacements Camera replacements began in November 2021. Customers receive invitations through the Tesla app to schedule service appointments for camera replacements. The process is staggered due to supply constraints, prioritizing vehicles with higher safety scores. Important Notes The replacement cameras feature a different type of color sensor compared to the original ones. Owners should check their Tesla app for notifications regarding eligibility and scheduling. If you own a Model 3 with Hardware 2.5 and have early production cameras, you may qualify for this replacement service.”

Unsustainable. I’ll subscribe when it’s down to $50/mo.

They already recently said they will. I think they are going to eat the cost on upgrading the old hardware with the hope that people upgraded to the newer cars and didn't keep the old ones

It’s a wonderful thing if you got it!

Discretioning, I assume. "Xyz is xyz-ing" is typically used to indicate an extreme xyz.

[deleted]

That’s what it says on mine. $49

😂 pray 🙏 hard

From my experience Carvana usually gives the best trade in value. Does your m3sr with 45k have FSD?

Why would we be upgraded? Delusional thinking.

From my experience Carvana usually gives the best trade in value. Does your m3sr with 45k have FSD?

Elon has discussed it as recently as the last earnings call. Not something I'm counting on but, it would be nice if he followed through with his promises.

[deleted]

Almost the exact same situation. But I had to pay to upgrade my cameras too.

$20k sounds about right in the ballpark. You will also save about $1250 in sales tax as well.

Ok I’m so glad I found someone that might find this information useful…… I have a 2018 M3 AWD. I bought the car with EAP and had it that way up until a year ago when I bought FSD. One of the reasons I paid the extra $2k for FSD was because I was starting to have issues that I were always told wouldnt correct due to the car having an Intel CPU. The main one that drove me nuts was the cameras would often depict a black screen for way too long before showing the actual camera view. I thought ‘you know what i like testing new tech let’s upgrade to FSD and see if I get a different software fork or something that makes some of these bugs go away.’ The day I got HW3 installed I drove around town to calibrate FSD and I never had those black camera screen issues again. And the Tesla tech I spoke to said he didn’t really have an explanation for it. So yeah Intel sucks for general UI thinks compared to newer cars but HW3 upgrade did seem to breath some life back into my car. I also changed my cameras out to the newer ones that have better light seals to reduce glare. Both things made my car feel younger and I’m glad I did them.

For $27k my whole 2019 M3P was upgraded to a 2025 M3P. The only thing I still have from the 2019 is it's FSD.

My understanding is that they will be compressing the stack for FSD so that it can run under hardware 3, and without the necessity of upgrading any hardware.

As an OG FSD owner, I’ll eat a literal piece of shit if Elon upgrades us.

I was about to ask the same question.

They don’t have to license the camera, the sensor requires them to pay a licensing fee.

So I have a used 2018 that came with enhanced autopilot. It says $2k for me on the Tesla app, I plan on keeping this car for awhile and it's at 111,000 miles. Still worth to buy it?

Yet still even if price goes up, unlikely you will ever be better off with outright purchase of it at 8k.

But the monthly sub is 99 usd and the fsd is 8k, forcthe lifetime of the car since you got hw3 means its already at least 2 years old. It’s not mathing mate. Should have stuck with the subscription.

Why? Were you an original owner?

Totally respect your decision, but gosh this really doesn’t seem like the smartest of moves. You could have spent the $8k on a HW4 vehicle, or on a down payment for a lease. You could probably throw it into the stock market at the next crash and double or triple it when the markets recover. I would refund it ASAP if you can.

There’s been a lot of discussion about hardware differences between those cars that are visible (the side cleaners, the new connectivity antennas). They’re not stock cars and there’s no reason to believe there are other hardware upgrades that are less visible (>5mp cameras, enhanced compute, new camera angles, new sensors)

As soon as you buy a new Tesla. Lol

I don’t think the cameras are clear enough.

I am right there with you ✊

The exciting thing is how will HW3 perform after they change the software to split the dual processors to work independently, rather than in redundant mode... that should provide close to a doubling of FSD performance.

You already paid 6k into it by buying Enhanced Autopilot.

True

Pretty much it, with all the mouth breathers driving around with their eyes glued to their phones running red lights etc....

I hope so, I love my 2023 Model 3 Performance, the front of the Highland does not convince me enough to trade mine in

L post

Mine is 6 years old and very little issues. These days I use FSD 90-95% of the time. Best car my wife and I ever owned and we've owned a bunch in our 34 year marriage! Plan to keep it 10 years. Battery life is amazing. I mainly charge at home so that could help battery life. Time will tell

The ROBOTAXI HW4 Model Ys have different cameras that can self clean + upgraded cellular/connectivity suite + running on different software. During the last investors call, Elon hoped to be in half of the states (aka cities) by end of 2026. I don't see it coming for at least 2 years, and by then HW5 will be out. HW4, and the public itself, will probably never get L4 Teslas. Simply too many lawsuits get opened up.

Same, especially considering how bad they are at stop signs.

dude, undo this purchase. put your money in something that makes you money and pay 100% a month. I can assure you putting your money in any asset over 6 years will be more than $8k. this is just financially silly.

Yes I was. I told them I wanted to get FSD (at the time still had EAP) but I was worried about the cameras working reliably since they didn’t work half the time as-is and they told me I had to pay for both. Didn’t know better at the time so just did it. Wasn’t a huge cost but still obviously more than zero.

Congrats! 🥳 Elon and Tesla said they will try to get FSD unsupervised to work on HW3, but if they can’t they will upgrade those that bought it. Plus Elon also said subscriptions will go up once more features are released. And when we add our Teslas to the Robotaxi network, it wouldn’t surprise me if Tesla takes a larger cut from those that didn’t buy FSD in full. You’ve made the right choice, congrats again!

lol they told us in 2019 buying you will never be able to transfer reality sales are down how do you get people to upgrade offer transfer

???

You guys are such shills. Your car was sold to you as hardware complete since 2019. Stand up for yourself and organize to ensure they make you whole.

Based on your screenshot, one can get the $99 FSD monthly subscription, use it for a couple of days on a roadtrip and then request a refund before the 48 hrs is up???

Why was this downvoted?

pray harder

It’s coming. That’s the beauty of owning a Tesla. Features that you never imagined one day magically appear in an update. Since I bought my Model 3 in 2023, here’s just some of the over-the-air upgrades that I’ve experienced: Matrix headlights automatically dim only where other cars are. The rest stays high beam. Bird’s eye parking assist view Apple Music Grok And of course improved FSD I know more improvements will come. Tesla the only car that actually gets better with age!

I got my car in the same year as you and half those things didn’t come for me. The matrix headlights which were all ways there came and now I have the same as other cheaper cars.

You don’t have the matrix lights? I got mine in March 23. It has matrix lights and the Ryzen processor.

I got matrix headlights and auto park, after 2 years.

Got mine upgraded as well, waiting for that service appointment. Although their initial estimate is absurd, will make them cut it to $0.

The self washing cameras make sense for a commercial taxi service where they don’t want to bring them in for service if it drives through mud etc etc. - don’t think it’s the deal breaker. Upgraded cellular suite is also only relevant for an uber like service - all data is being processed on board.

😂😂😂😂

I had an HW3 car before and loved the V12, but it was a bit frustrating watching HW4 users get all these updates while we HW3 owners were left in the dust. Looking back, though, something I didn’t really think about until recently is that you're technically buying Full Self-Driving **(Supervised)**, not necessarily the unsupervised version. Legally, I’m not sure there’s any binding commitment for Tesla to give you Full Self-Driving (Unsupervised) when it becomes available. They probably will, but who knows? With Elon’s track record, it's hard to say. 🤷‍♂️ If I had to guess, I think HW3 will eventually get a “lite” version of v14, and when FSD unsupervised becomes a reality, people who purchased FSD might get basic access with some kind of upgrade subscription. But that’s just a guess. We’ll have to check back in a few years to see how this all plays out.

BTW: There is no such thing as a 2018 M3 RWD or 2018 M3 AWD. It is/was called a 2018 Model 3 Long Range (LR) that had an option for single or dual motor, just like the option for 18, 19, or 20-inch wheels. It was years later that Tesla made versions called RWD or AWD.

If they weren’t dealbreakers then the Tesla owners in the geofenced Robotaxi areas should be able to utilize unsupervised in those locations. Can they? The point is that a separation already exists. It will only widen. Not a single consumer owned Tesla on the road today will be allowed unsupervised FSD. Tesla is pivoting to a taxi service only for their future vehicles.

I don’t think this line of thinking passes the sniff test - the point of pilot programs are to pilot something - they just put out about a dozen vehicles unsupervised a little over a week ago… I don’t think it’s fair to say that everyone in Austin should be permitted to get in the back seat of their vehicle along the bus route as a result, lol. Yes, I agree though - fully unsupervised without some extra hardware somewhere is probably unlikely. I do however see the amount of supervision enforced to go down drastically - as in maybe it doesn’t care if you’re looking at all along the highway, etc etc.

Thanks for that...I was thinking it was some kind of Chinese slang I wasn't aware of.

Hardware?? It gonna happen. FSD 14 Lite is your best hope.

Never gonna happen

If Tesla / Elon doesn't upgrade HW3 owners you can better believe I will never buy/ upgrade to another Tesla car or anything else they make for the rest of my life.

Bro.. I hope you not in EU.

I bet the cameras (resolution) will be the biggest problem with HW3 going unsupervised.

Eh, HW4 is running unsupervised every day

I bought my M3 FSD -19 used in the 2021, people were laughing at me. I knew its not usable in years in europe. Now I ordered new 2026 M3 long range AWD and used FSD transfer option. Nobodys laughing now..

I did that. I have FSD in my 2019 M3, now waiting brand new M3 to arrive. Transfered my FSD to new car. Waited this moment all these years.

I bet Elon has different mindset. By investing HW3 he gets most of the fleet active, its not a loss in long run. It will pay back in form of subscriptions. Tesla fleet is like millions of workers paying to do its job.

Anything is possible, but there are too many risks involved for the cost. For example, you’re not guaranteed that everyone will subscribe or if the cars themselves will even last long enough to get their moneys worth out of subscriptions since the accident total rate for them is very high as a result of increased labor and expensive parts costs. For any business, especially a car business, it makes much more financial sense to sell you a new vehicle that is already up to date and offer more “cool” features to make every owner of the newest model feel like they are getting their moneys worth and stay as a potential long-term customer. Not to mention the fact that corporations take advantage of human feelings all the time if it means a financial return on investment. For older model owners or potential new customers, they will start to get a sense of FOMO and want to finance/lease a newer model when they see what they are missing out on and regardless, over time they will have to get a new vehicle when the price of repairs start to outweigh the value of the car as is the case with any vehicle on the road. You have to understand that upgrading from HW3 to HW4 is not a simple firmware update. They need to replace all cameras on the vehicle, replace the control module for them, replace some wire harnesses, pay for all the parts, pay for labor at each service location to have all the parts replaced, pay for accidental part damage since a lot of things need to come apart to access the parts, pay for loaner vehicles since its not a quick job, pay for insurance for the loaner vehicles, pay for transportation costs for the loaner vehicles. Multiply that by all the HW3 vehicles on the road and you are talking several tens if not hundreds of millions of dollars for something that is not guaranteed. A cheaper alternative for Tesla to get older model owners on the same page is to offer a higher trade-in price for all the HW3 vehicles. This would cost them significantly less than upgrading each HW3 vehicle and they get a car in return that they could either resell or recycle.

Just fyi if you crash that car you just lost 8 grand in a puff of smoke. Terrible financial decision but you do you!

It is well insured...

😅🤣😂 there's one born every minute

100% agree autopilot is good FSD like a 16 year old person learning to drive that needs to be monitored lol

What would the incentive be for Tesla to do this? It is better financially, for tesla, if you buy a new car vs them paying to provide HW4, right?

Elon Musk Jan. 2026- “I mean, I think the honest answer is that we’re going to have to upgrade people’s Hardware 3 computers for those that have bought Full Self-Driving, and that is the honest answer, and that’s going to be painful and difficult, but we’ll get it done. Now I’m kind of glad that not that many people bought the FSD package.”

I am waiting for something like this. Upgrade my M3 to HW4/5 or settle with me for claims about fully autonomous driving that never were delivered.

This is absolutely not happening. Elon said himself they would only upgrade once FSD is fully solved. I have had FSD on one Model X since 2016, and still waiting. It’s one of the reasons I haven’t jumped at purchasing FSD on my other 2016 vehicles. The car is good enough I don’t feel the need to upgrade into a newer model, so I never took advantage of transferring the FSD. But I really shouldn’t have to be enticed to. They should be upgrading our hardware in good faith. Really unfortunate.

I'd be curious about that. AFAIK the sensors were dumb sensors and their software was managing all the things related to them, and that they were fairly cheap sensors.

It’s all a cost. Why do you think they don’t have a tried and true automatic wiper sensor? They don’t want to license or pay for it. The auto wipers are one of the biggest complaints about Tesla’s. Those things have never worked 25% as well as any other car with auto wipers I’ve driven. I don’t think Tesla had to license the lidar but it was money they felt like they could save. When you’re selling a million+ vehicles per year, that adds up.

Can’t they integrate grok thru your cellphone and just have it play speak over Bluetooth ? Ahhaaa!!

They’re profit margin is fine. Maybe worry less about giving the guy at the top $1bil/yr and more about not nickel and diming the cars. I have still seen no evidence that any of the sensors had any fees outside of their nit costs attached to them, which AFAIK w/ USS, was cheaper than cameras.

Oh I did buy it. Now waiting for the hw upgrade service appointment, the estimate only calls out the computer upgrade and related parts though. I will ask them when I go there to drop off about the cameras. Concern: Full Self-Driving Car Computer Retrofit, Model 3 Repair Notes: Correction Car Computer - HW2.5 to HW3 (Retrofit) 2 Parts Replaced or Added Part Quantity TLA,CAR.COMP ,NA,HW3.0 1.00 -PROVISIONED FOR RETROFIT(1462554-R0-L)

I would think they would stick with the 100 dollars a month for FSD. Most people probably like it but wouldn't pony up huge dollars each month for a sometimes usable or use it at your own risk. If in the future it gets to full automation and protected and backed by state and corporation... You could make an argument its worth a little more however, people probably won't pay for it if its to expensive. If you love it, you will use it.. If you don't care that much.. you won't. But at 100.00 its probably worth it for most Tesla owners. Although getting rid of all the auto steer stuff may make it much more attractive at 100 bucks a month... Certainly will.

So what is considered v14 light? I’m looking forward to the car parking itself. Suffering from FOMO. 😂